Can we agree that only NAZIs ban books?

selmaborntidefan

TideFans Legend
Mar 31, 2000
37,913
32,811
287
55
OK, my turn in the barrel as the Village Idiot.

How in the hell can you REALLY "ban books" in the Internet age? Sure, you can remove them from your local library, but with stuff like Amazon and Kindle, etc, it seems to me to be the most counter-productive attempt at censorship I can even imagine. We all have curiosity about the forbidden fruit. The moment you tell people, "You can't do something," what is human nature? "I gotta do THAT!"

Sure, you can take them off the school library shelves, it's not going to stop the determined from reading it. The days when you can eliminate someone finding the book by burning every one of them in the county back in a pre-Interstate age is long gone. Most of them determined to read it will have the PDF sent to them on Facebook Messenger before they awaken tomorrow, along with the answers to the biology test and the teacher's latest OnlyFans upload (I'm sworn to secrecy on this one....)

Book bans to me have always basically been the same thing as, "Young lady, you will not date that hoodlum boy."

You know what's going to happen every time.
 

Padreruf

Hall of Fame
Feb 12, 2001
9,081
13,091
287
74
Charleston, South Carolina
Or, you cannot go see/or show that movie...fills up the theater every time. Years ago my father was on a ministers' group picked to preview a film that was slated to be banned. I asked him what he thought...He said "It was a senseless movie that on its own will fail miserable. However, the moment we ban it the theater will be packed." He was 100% correct.
 

Tidewater

FB|NS|NSNP Moderator
Staff member
Mar 15, 2003
24,235
18,001
337
Hooterville, Vir.
I would disagree with the characterization "banning."
Banning would mean no one of any age can procure a particular book.
"Not available in a school library where minors can check them out without any adult supervision" is not banning. Every school library has millions of books they do not carry on their shelves.
Any parent can procure from Amazon or most public libraries, these "banned" books because these "banned" books are not really banned.
 

dtgreg

All-American
Jul 24, 2000
3,620
2,480
282
Tuscaloosa
www.electricmonkeywrench.com
OK, my turn in the barrel as the Village Idiot.

How in the hell can you REALLY "ban books" in the Internet age? Sure, you can remove them from your local library, but with stuff like Amazon and Kindle, etc, it seems to me to be the most counter-productive attempt at censorship I can even imagine. We all have curiosity about the forbidden fruit. The moment you tell people, "You can't do something," what is human nature? "I gotta do THAT!"

Sure, you can take them off the school library shelves, it's not going to stop the determined from reading it. The days when you can eliminate someone finding the book by burning every one of them in the county back in a pre-Interstate age is long gone. Most of them determined to read it will have the PDF sent to them on Facebook Messenger before they awaken tomorrow, along with the answers to the biology test and the teacher's latest OnlyFans upload (I'm sworn to secrecy on this one....)

Book bans to me have always basically been the same thing as, "Young lady, you will not date that hoodlum boy."

You know what's going to happen every time.
We all live in bubbles, some moreso than others. I grew up in the Rocket City. As a six and seven-year-old in the late '60s, I KNEW that mean were suprior to women. I never knew about "computers" like Vivian Figures (wonder why?) and the very idea that a black woman would be depended upon by the likes of space hero John Glenn would have been as outlandish to me as Rock Hudson being outted as gay.

Yes, the "determined" will find a way but most folks have lives. They are easily propagandized and after a while, it becomes very difficult to reject all you have "known" your whole life and what your parents believe and what you church teaches. A bridge way too far for most.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jon and 92tide

75thru79

Scout Team
Nov 22, 2024
180
243
52
I would disagree with the characterization "banning."
Banning would mean no one of any age can procure a particular book.
"Not available in a school library where minors can check them out without any adult supervision" is not banning. Every school library has millions of books they do not carry on their shelves.
Any parent can procure from Amazon or most public libraries, these "banned" books because these "banned" books are not really banned.
You've either got to stop making sense or go back to the Football board.
 
  • Like
Reactions: AWRTR

DzynKingRTR

TideFans Legend
Dec 17, 2003
46,236
36,486
287
Vinings, ga., usa
Or, you cannot go see/or show that movie...fills up the theater every time. Years ago my father was on a ministers' group picked to preview a film that was slated to be banned. I asked him what he thought...He said "It was a senseless movie that on its own will fail miserable. However, the moment we ban it the theater will be packed." He was 100% correct.
Married with Children is the perfect example of a TV show that became hugely popular because of some Karen in Michigan. It is why I started watching.

Also, Catcher in the Rye. I only started reading it because it was banned. I learned it was terrible and did not get any further than 26 pages. Holden Caufield is whiney and annoying. I wanted to jump into the novel and beat him up.

and to answer the original question, no not just Nazis ban books
 
Last edited:

Its On A Slab

All-SEC
Apr 18, 2018
1,909
3,194
182
Pyongyang, Democratic Republic of Korea
The problem I have with the current right-wing agenda is the über-emphasis on American Exceptionalism. To the extent that they want to white-wash where the US was not so great not so good, white-wash events in the past that continue to resonate today. (Civil Rights struggle, US interventions in Nam, Iraq, Afghanistan, especially So. America with Operation Condor, the Civil War, etc).

We live in a great country, but it has not always done good/great things. "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana
 

Tidewater

FB|NS|NSNP Moderator
Staff member
Mar 15, 2003
24,235
18,001
337
Hooterville, Vir.
The problem I have with the current right-wing agenda is the über-emphasis on American Exceptionalism. To the extent that they want to white-wash where the US was not so great not so good, white-wash events in the past that continue to resonate today. (Civil Rights struggle, US interventions in Nam, Iraq, Afghanistan, especially So. America with Operation Condor, the Civil War, etc).

We live in a great country, but it has not always done good/great things. "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana
I agree, but there is an age-appropriate point for the introduction of aspects of the story.
For first graders, it is probably okay to introduce the Pilgrims and Thanksgiving in its sanitized form, as examples of peaceful coexistence and cooperation.
I would not teach first graders this about the Mohegan allies of the English in King Phillip's War:

Mohegans captured a Narragansett enemy.

This cruel monster [the Narragansett enemy] is now fallen into the hands of those [Mohegans] that will repay him sevenfold. In the first place, therefore, making a great circle, they placed him in the middle that all their eyes might at the same time, be pleased with utmost revenge upon him; they first cut one of his fingers round in the joint, at the trunk of his hand, with a sharp knife, and then broke it off, as men used to do with a slaughtered beast, before he is uncased; then they cut off another and another after, till they had dismembered one hand of all its digits, the blood, sometimes spurting out and streams a yard from his hand, which barbarous and unheard of cruelty, the English were not able to bear, it forcing tears from their eyes; yet did not the sufferer ever relent, or shew any signs of anguish; for, being asked by his tormentor how he liked this war, he replied, he liked it very well, and found it as sweet as the Englishmen did their sugar. In this frame, he continued, till his executioners had dealt with his toes of his feet as they had done with his fingers of his hands; all the time making him dance around the circle, and sing till they had wearied both himself and them. At last they broke the bones of his legs after which he was forced to sit down, which by some tis said he silently did, till they had knocked out his brains.
William Hubbard A Narrative of the Indian Wars in New England from the First Planting Thereof in the Year 1607 to the Year 1677 (Norwich: John Trumbull, 1802), 172-3.

That aspect can probably wait until high school.
 

Bodhisattva

Hall of Fame
Aug 22, 2001
22,328
3,688
287
Ponte Vedra Beach, Florida
Is it me, or whenever I read "Can we all agree..." my knee-jerk reaction to the post, no matter the subject, is...No. ;) Perhaps I'm too contrarian.
That's probably because, invariably, it ends up being "Can we all agree that my tribe is super-intelligent, wise, objective, and good while anyone who doesn't believe this is a Nazi, and potentially an aloof one." :cool:
 

selmaborntidefan

TideFans Legend
Mar 31, 2000
37,913
32,811
287
55
Or, you cannot go see/or show that movie...fills up the theater every time. Years ago my father was on a ministers' group picked to preview a film that was slated to be banned. I asked him what he thought...He said "It was a senseless movie that on its own will fail miserable. However, the moment we ban it the theater will be packed." He was 100% correct.
"Last Temptation of Christ"?????

(Amusingly enough, I took Psychology the spring after that movie came out, and we discussed that very phenomenon).
 

selmaborntidefan

TideFans Legend
Mar 31, 2000
37,913
32,811
287
55
We all live in bubbles, some moreso than others. I grew up in the Rocket City. As a six and seven-year-old in the late '60s, I KNEW that mean were suprior to women. I never knew about "computers" like Vivian Figures (wonder why?) and the very idea that a black woman would be depended upon by the likes of space hero John Glenn would have been as outlandish to me as Rock Hudson being outted as gay.

Yes, the "determined" will find a way but most folks have lives. They are easily propagandized and after a while, it becomes very difficult to reject all you have "known" your whole life and what your parents believe and what you church teaches. A bridge way too far for most.
Again - just to be clear - I'm not ADVOCATING censorship, although we all do to some extent (the only question is where we draw the line). Unless someone is advocating the placement of "Playboy" magazine in the 4th grade school library, even the most libertarian among us have lines that are drawn that may not be called censorship, but they still are to some degree (we just rename it "age appropriate" and then censor it anyway).

My mother knew Rock Hudson was gay LONG before the general public did, and my mother is as straight-laced Baptist as one can be. She thought it was obvious, not Paul Lynde or Charles Nelson Reilly obvious, but she knew it back in the late 60s. Btw - if you remember when Hudson died of AIDS in 1985, the media went out of its way (just as they did with Magic Johnson) to make sure we "knew" he WAS NOT gay; the big reveal came later when his lover told all in (I believe it was) "People."

WKRP did an excellent episode (boy am I dating myself now) on censorship where a Falwell caricature wanted to control what went out over the airwaves and Mr. Carlson wound up showing to him his own hypocrisy.

In the Internet age, I'm sorry, it's just not possible to "ban" books.

And btw - I'm all in favor of teachers BANNING certain books for submission for book reports, just don't say "you can't read this on your own." My Speech teacher was as liberal as they came, but on the first day of class (and this is in college) told us there were three "banned" topics for speeches: abortion, gun control, and the death penalty. And she basically said that the reasons were that all of the arguments had been made and all they really did was upset people one way or the other, and it made it more difficult for THE CLASS to learn from the submitted materials.

(Side note: one of my classmates did a speech on date rape - which was becoming a more well-known topic in 1988 - and whoa boy, would he be rightly torched today; the hot blonde who sat next to me (I never learned much in that class, LOL!) and I looked at each other like, "Whoa, we understand there ARE rare cases of a woman falsely accusing a guy of rape but MAN!")
 
  • Like
Reactions: dtgreg

Amazon Deals for TideFans!

YouTheFan Alabama Desk Pad

Purchases may result in a commission being paid to TideFans.

Latest threads