13 National Championships

[Alabama Larry in Ky]

On a local sports site that deals with Kentucky high school sports and other issues that I belong to has asked some questions.

Several of the members are questioning our 13 total NCs. They have showed eight as being the most. I have debated them for several posts on this issue and Ky Throughbred has posted highlights of all 13, and they still want to argue.

I have even as gone as far as saying the 1965/1973 NCs came before the bowl games but we lost the bowls and todays standards we would not recieve hardware for these two, but I explained the 1966 NC going to Norte Dame. This does kinda of equal out.

So, I told them I'd go on here and ask Bama Nation. Should we not count 1965/1973? And why do we claim 13 when everyone wants to give us eight.

The site is Bluegrasspreps.com Its a paysite but you can look and read as a guest. I'm "Alabama Larry" on there.

They also love to post any problem about Bama and flock to the thread like hungary puppies. Posting about Trent several weeks ago and Brent Calloway recently.

 

[TideEngineer08]

You will get nowhere with that discussion.

Fans of opposing teams will belittle Alabama's accomplishments because there are so few teams that even come close.

Of course Alabama should count 1965 and 1973. They were major polls won by the rules of the day. If someone wants to debate the titles won before 1961 (Alabama's first AP title), then that is a different debate. Most like to say that Alabama was "retroactively" awarded those titles, but some research has shown newspaper articles of the day which were written about Alabama winning the National Championship when they won all those Rose Bowls in those years. And trophies are in the case from those years, so some respected entity thought of Alabama as champions in those years.

Whatever metric you want to choose, Alabama takes a back seat to no one except possibly Notre Dame.

 

[SavannahDare]

The only one I ever take issue with is the 1941. All the others were awarded "fair and square" as they say.

 

[GMacFan]

I can't count years in which we lost our final games to superior teams as "championship seasons," I have too much pride for our program. Championships are won on the field; Texas and Notre Dame should've been champions in 1965 and 1973. They were undefeated and they beat us in the final game of the season. The voters got it wrong, there's no other way to slice it; champions don't lose their bowl game.

Of course we were by all indications the best team in 1966 and got jipped, I count that as a national championship season.

 

[Bamabuzzard]

Jon Saunders felt the need to address the Bama fans on The Sportsreporters and correct us to say that we only had 8 titles. He basically did not count anything before the AP poll. I would like to ask Saunders if all the statistics from games played prior to the AP poll need to be eliminated and "not counted" as well? Just erase them from the books. Erase all the wins an institution racked up before the AP poll. Football was played long before the AP poll came out. Do we simply act like nothing ever happened before the AP poll?

 

[bamanut_aj]

FWIW, the NCAA recognizes 11, whether outright or shared.

FBS Football Championship History - NCAA.com

 

[TideEngineer08]

I can't count years in which we lost our final games to superior teams as "championship seasons," I have too much pride for our program. Championships are won on the field; Texas and Notre Dame should've been champions in 1965 and 1973. They were undefeated and they beat us in the final game of the season. The voters got it wrong, there's no other way to slice it; champions don't lose their bowl game.

Of course we were by all indications the best team in 1966 and got jipped, I count that as a national championship season.

There is no shame or lack of pride in claiming those seasons. We have the trophies from the AP and UPI polls. In other words, Alabama played both games knowing it was already crowned champion in one major poll. Yeah, it was a flawed system, with the voting taking place before the bowl games. This was from a mindset of the bowl games being glorified exhibitions in the early days. What with the games being played a full month to a month and a half after the regular season ends, you're talking about completely different teams once those games were played. That's still a major flaw in the system today.

In the end, it doesn't really matter. Alabama's a winner, and always has been. Few programs have risen to the level Alabama has, and that is something to take pride in.

 

[ccc2259]

I love Charles Barkley's reply to this question......"Well, they got the trophies from 13 championships!"

 

[fralo4tide]

Wait a moment! Someone is questioning Bama's championships???

Wow...that's a first!

 

[GMacFan]

There is no shame or lack of pride in claiming those seasons. We have the trophies from the AP and UPI polls. In other words, Alabama played both games knowing it was already crowned champion in one major poll. Yeah, it was a flawed system, with the voting taking place before the bowl games. This was from a mindset of the bowl games being glorified exhibitions in the early days. What with the games being played a full month to a month and a half after the regular season ends, you're talking about completely different teams once those games were played. That's still a major flaw in the system today.

In the end, it doesn't really matter. Alabama's a winner, and always has been. Few programs have risen to the level Alabama has, and that is something to take pride in.

I don't think Bryant had the mindset that a bowl game was a glorified exhibition game. He prepared for the bowl games just as hard as he did for the regular season. And in both cases we were facing our toughest opponent of the season, and two of the blue bloods of college football. You gotta get up for a game like that. I do agree with you about the layoff having a big effect on the outcome of bowl games, but Texas and Notre Dame both had the same layoff. Maybe the outcome would have been different had we played them during the regular season, but as it stands, Texas and Notre Dame beat us. Both games came down to the last couple of plays; our guys wanted it just as bad as they did. It's not like our guys were like, oh, it's just a bowl game, we're already champions. They were still trying to prove they were worthy of that title IMO

 

[LCN]

If anyone cares to run an extensive search , they'll quickly discover that Alabama claims only 13 of the either 31 or 34 titles which it has been awarded .

 

[BamaJeff]

Jon Saunders felt the need to address the Bama fans on The Sportsreporters and correct us to say that we only had 8 titles. He basically did not count anything before the AP poll. I would like to ask Saunders if all the statistics from games played prior to the AP poll need to be eliminated and "not counted" as well? Just erase them from the books. Erase all the wins an institution racked up before the AP poll. Football was played long before the AP poll came out. Do we simply act like nothing ever happened before the AP poll?

This is what I always ask anyone who wants to dispute our earlier titles.

 

[selmaborntidefan]

John Saunders is a corporate shill who spouts the party line. I've got a sizeable collection of Alabama tapes. One I have is the 2002 OU-Alabama game. In the pregame Saunders says it matches OU, with 7 national titles, against Alabama with 6. This from his own mouth. Now simple math: if we had 6 titles in 2002 and have only added one then how could Saunders say it was only our eighth on 10 January 2010 on The Sports Reporters? The answer is found in:

A) in 2002 ABC showed Big 12 games while CBS had the SEC
B) Abc on ESPN carried our BCS title win in 2010

In other words, the number of titles we've won is determined by WHO is broadcasting us.

Further proof: at the 2000 Orange Bowl, NBC's Dick Enberg presented us as having "won 10 national championships, second only to Notre Dame." Why second to ND? Well, what team's games has NBCbroadcast since 1991? You got it!

Somehow between Jan 2000 and Sept 2002, we changed the channel and lost THREE national championships!

Oh and guess what? This same Dick Enberg said when OU won the 86 Orange Bowl that it was their sixth title "more than any other school." So not only did we lose 3 titles but with the same broadcaster we somehow won 4 national titles between 1986-1999. I'm sure I'd remember those!

Finally, there's Frank Broyles, who would say we won 5. I have him saying it in the 1985 UGA game first half. I have no doubt this was not sour grapes from 1964 when Frank won 1/2 a title at Ark.

So it all depends who is talking!!

But guess what? If Alabama's titles don't count then neither do the stats of Knute Rockne, there were no Four Horsemen, and OU's Big 8 titles from 1907-1935 don't count either. Michigan never won however many games in a row & Jim Thorpe and Pop Warner never existed.

I'm just saying....

 

[owenfieldreams]

I saw an article a few days ago, I think it was in Bleacherreport that indicated that you all might be short changing yourselves. According to the research quoted, both Alabama and OU have 17 NC's.

Apparently the writer went back and pulled out every conceivable N.C. award both schools had garnered. Now, I am not saying this is gospel. We claim a legit 7. One thing to remember. Alabama has a much longer history in terms of being a power in college football than OU. We really didn't get rolling until right after WW11.

 

[rolltide2213]

We have been awarded like 31 but only claim 13.

 

[Shortround]

On a local sports site that deals with Kentucky high school sports and other issues that I belong to has asked some questions.

Several of the members are questioning our 13 total NCs. They have showed eight as being the most. I have debated them for several posts on this issue and Ky Throughbred has posted highlights of all 13, and they still want to argue.

I have even as gone as far as saying the 1965/1973 NCs came before the bowl games but we lost the bowls and todays standards we would not recieve hardware for these two, but I explained the 1966 NC going to Norte Dame. This does kinda of equal out.

So, I told them I'd go on here and ask Bama Nation. Should we not count 1965/1973? And why do we claim 13 when everyone wants to give us eight.

The site is Bluegrasspreps.com Its a paysite but you can look and read as a guest. I'm "Alabama Larry" on there.

They also love to post any problem about Bama and flock to the thread like hungary puppies. Posting about Trent several weeks ago and Brent Calloway recently.

The offical NCAA site credits us with 11.

 

[mittman]

The only thing I think is sad or wrong is those that would belittle the accomplishments of teams that were honored this way. I would rather be acused of (as Stacy said '41 case is the only one I believe falls into the category) stretching one, than accused of not giving a team the rightful place in our history.

 

[DurdenTider]

I hate when people say that the system back then sucked so we didn't deserve the championships for certain years. The BCS sucks now and 50 years from now people will say that UA didn't deserve the NC b/c Boise State went undefeated too. There is no perfect system but it's the system that college football was using at the time and somehow Alabama was awarded a championship. That's just how it goes.

 

[Redwood Forrest]

I hate when people say that the system back then sucked so we didn't deserve the championships for certain years. The BCS sucks now and 50 years from now people will say that UA didn't deserve the NC b/c Boise State went undefeated too. There is no perfect system but it's the system that college football was using at the time and somehow Alabama was awarded a championship. That's just how it goes.

My Bama shirt asks, "Got 13?" That is good enough for me. Let the objectors wear one that says, "Bama does not have 13!" if they want to, I don't mind. :biggrin2:

Question: Who gets to decide which poll(s) are accurate and reliable? The BCS? The NCAA? The FWA? A CNN/USA Today poll?

What makes the NCAA experts on polls? Or anyone else?

 

[boatmax]

I can't count years in which we lost our final games to superior teams as "championship seasons," I have too much pride for our program. Championships are won on the field; Texas and Notre Dame should've been champions in 1965 and 1973. They were undefeated and they beat us in the final game of the season. The voters got it wrong, there's no other way to slice it; champions don't lose their bowl game.

Of course we were by all indications the best team in 1966 and got jipped, I count that as a national championship season.

Texas cheated Alabama of the Orange bowl vistory in 1965. Joe Namath ran the ball, was over the line, and TX nost tackle, All American Tommy Nobis pushed him back over the line under the pile. Namath came back and told Coach Bryant that he was over the line. Coach bryant only said "it shouldn't have been that close". When Tommy Nobis retired from the NFL, he admitted that Namath was indeed over the line and that he had pushed him back across, from underneath the pile up. YES INDEED COUNT IT.