Green New Deal

[MattinBama]

Why was this resolution presented in the first place?

To make a show of getting the Dems to vote on something that isn't hammered out and has some wording that isn't fully fleshed out and that they could then use as sound bites in scare tactic ads against them in elections.

It definitely wasn't presented by McConnell because he believes in working towards fixing our climate situation.

Edited to add - Also because the media is dumb and is putting up headlines like this that provide zero context:

 

[crimsonaudio]

Of course, I get that - but if it was a pointless thing in the first place, why did AOC even present the GND to the Senate, rather than just champion the ideals behind it?

There are reasons that resolutions exist - if no one intended to support his, why was it ever even presented in the first place?

 

[rgw]

I like the broad strokes of the Green New Deal but it is always in the details. Global warming is real. The third world is already living in the leading edge of the repercussions of it. I like the idea of turning the need to withstand and repel climate change into a New Deal scale work program that can give rural places like Fayette, AL more career opportunities than working at McDonalds, Jacks, or Walmart. If it turns into some make-rich scheme for the already wealthy then it will be another cash-for-clunkers type failure.

It obviously shouldn't and couldn't pass right now. Even so, I don't think it should be abandoned but this is something that needs foresight and a less corrupt politicians in control of each party to pull off without it being another green legislation as a way to enrich special interests.

 

[MattinBama]

Of course, I get that - but if it was a pointless thing in the first place, why did AOC even present the GND to the Senate, rather than just champion the ideals behind it?

There are reasons that resolutions exist - if no one intended to support his, why was it ever even presented in the first place?

AOC did not present it to the Senate. McConnell did. She is in the House.

 

[crimsonaudio]

It obviously shouldn't and couldn't pass right now. Even so, I don't think it should be abandoned but this is something that needs foresight and a less corrupt politicians in control of each party to pull off without it being another green legislation as a way to enrich special interests.

And it needs politicians who will think it through thoroughly rather than throwing whatever crosses their mind out there to see if it sticks. Beyond that, it's time that those who believe in GW actually act on that belief instead of waffling, even in gamesmanship situations like this - where it makes it appear that the political aspect of it is more important than our very survival.

My frustration is that instead of unanimously voting for the GND - even knowing it couldn't pass - the dems are now essentially on record as not being for it (from a political perspective). We have so many people with their head buried in the sand wrt GW that all they need is to see politicians continuing to use it as chess piece to re-bury their heads, no convinced it's all a sham.

 

[crimsonaudio]

AOC did not present it to the Senate. McConnell did. She is in the House.

Touché.

But they could have done the same in the house and likely would have had similar results. It's time for the Ds to lead instead of playing these silly games.

 

[rgw]

The main body of the democratic party isn't really with the progressive wing on global warming or healthcare. It is fair to say that the main body of the DNP has more in common with the GOP than they care to admit. Hard to argue when both are accepting financial support from largely the same people. I've said it over and over to my liberal friends that social liberalism alone is not enough and this reality will come home to roost eventually.

 

[92tide]

AOC did not present it to the Senate. McConnell did. She is in the House.

link

Sponsor: Sen. McConnell, Mitch [R-KY] (Introduced 02/13/2019)
Latest Action: Senate - 03/26/2019 Cloture on the motion to proceed to the measure not invoked in Senate by Yea-Nay Vote. 0 - 57. Record Vote Number: 52. (CR S1971) (All Actions)
Roll Call Votes: There has been 1 roll call vote

 

[Bamaro]

Touché.

But they could have done the same in the house and likely would have had similar results. It's time for the Ds to lead instead of playing these silly games.

It was McConnell who was trying to play silly games. The dems simply chose to ignore his made up game.

 

[crimsonaudio]

The main body of the democratic party isn't really with the progressive wing on global warming or healthcare. It is fair to say that the main body of the DNP has more in common with the GOP than they care to admit. Hard to argue when both are accepting financial support from largely the same people. I've said it over and over to my liberal friends that social liberalism alone is not enough and this reality will come home to roost eventually.

We have to do something about GW, and it's obvious the repubs are bought and paid for by big oil - yet the dems don't seems to be willing to distance themselves regarding this. It's so frustrating. Both parties are broken, but this seems like the perfect avenue for one of the parties to step up and take control.

 

[92tide]

Touché.

But they could have done the same in the house and likely would have had similar results. It's time for the Ds to lead instead of playing these silly games.

what would you consider leading? there is a lot more that goes into creating policy than show votes and very little of that makes headlines.

 

[MattinBama]

Touché.

But they could have done the same in the house and likely would have had similar results. It's time for the Ds to lead instead of playing these silly games.

They might would have similar results if they did the same thing right now in the House because the current state of the Green New Deal is just a wishlist/idea on a website, not a bill.

 

[crimsonaudio]

It was McConnell who was trying to play silly games. The dems simply chose to ignore his made up game.

Yup, established - but they did exactly as he expected and essentially gave him a victory. They know it wouldn't pass the senate - they don't have the votes - so even as a symbolic gesture they could have voted for it, showing that SOMETHING is necessary. Instead they gave the repubs more fodder to argue that it's just a political dance by the dems.

 

[rgw]

We have to do something about GW, and it's obvious the repubs are bought and paid for by big oil - yet the dems don't seems to be willing to distance themselves regarding this. It's so frustrating. Both parties are broken, but this seems like the perfect avenue for one of the parties to step up and take control.

Not only that but the reasonable actions to take as a people for global warming is going to be a disruptive force across all industries. Companies prefer to do the "disrupting" not being disrupted.

 

[92tide]

Yup, established - but they did exactly as he expected and essentially gave him a victory. They know it wouldn't pass the senate - they don't have the votes - so even as a symbolic gesture they could have voted for it, showing that SOMETHING is necessary. Instead they gave the repubs more fodder to argue that it's just a political dance by the dems.

the repubs are going to do this regardless of what the democrats do. they always have.

 

[92tide]

Yup, established - but they did exactly as he expected and essentially gave him a victory. They know it wouldn't pass the senate - they don't have the votes - so even as a symbolic gesture they could have voted for it, showing that SOMETHING is necessary. Instead they gave the repubs more fodder to argue that it's just a political dance by the dems.

the repubs are going to do this regardless of what the democrats do. they always have.

 

[rgw]

[tweet]1110576904288043008[/tweet]

 

[MattinBama]

Yup, established - but they did exactly as he expected and essentially gave him a victory. They know it wouldn't pass the senate - they don't have the votes - so even as a symbolic gesture they could have voted for it, showing that SOMETHING is necessary. Instead they gave the repubs more fodder to argue that it's just a political dance by the dems.

And if they lose their elections in part because they voted for this meaningless political stunt by McConnell that is used to drum up fear of the scary brown socialist girl's ideas then how are they going to be in the Senate to do something about climate change when Dems possibly have a majority? Or a majority that could do something about climate change is prevented because they lost their seat, etc.

 

[rgw]

the repubs are going to do this regardless of what the democrats do. they always have.

I think they did this not to protect themselves from the GOP attack ads but to protect themselves from grassroot resentment from their base when a litmus test progressive legislation was on the floor and they voted no.

 

[chanson78]

Yup, established - but they did exactly as he expected and essentially gave him a victory. They know it wouldn't pass the senate - they don't have the votes - so even as a symbolic gesture they could have voted for it, showing that SOMETHING is necessary. Instead they gave the repubs more fodder to argue that it's just a political dance by the dems.

Devils advocate. Had they actually voted for the bill, then the political ads would have been "LOOK AT THIS CRAZY PERSON WHO VOTED TO RAISE YOUR TAXES, TAKE AWAY YOUR COAL, AND MAKE ALL THE UNBORN BABBIES COLD BY REMOVING THIS WONDERFUL WARM WEATHER!"

I am surprised AOC and those who co-sponsored the bill (it says on behalf of, not sure if that wording is the same thing as a co-sponsor) didn't see this as a possible outcome.

It was McConnell who was trying to play silly games. The dems simply chose to ignore his made up game.

I disagree. Both sides are playing games. The dems put up a bill to get people talking that they knew didn't have the votes. The republicans, decided to do something they rarely do and actually take up legislation that isn't about spending money, hurting brown people, or blowing stuff up, and called their bluff. Say what you want, a bill never becomes law without a vote. If you put a bill up, you should kind of expect that it might get a vote. I know McConnell wasn't voting on the bill that AOC put up, but to say the Dems weren't doing any gamesmanship by putting up a bill that they never expected to vote on, is a bit much.