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New healthcare thread (part II)

dtgreg said:
OK, ELI5. I don't understand what's going on here except a health professional is afraid for his life from Trump's vengeance. For what? Even if there was some hideous plan to kill Americans to help Biden win an election, what about Moderna? The other vaccine companies? They were all in on it? If so, why? Why would they risk their lives for a Biden win?

Make it make sense.
Click to expand...


news.bloomberglaw.com

Ex-Pfizer Doctor Tells Congress He Didn’t Delay Covid Shot Data

A former Pfizer Inc. scientist denied an allegation made by House Republicans that he conspired to delay the release of Covid shot data to hurt Donald Trump’s 2020 election prospects, the latest twist in a dispute that demonstrates how vaccines are increasingly becoming a political flashpoint.
news.bloomberglaw.com news.bloomberglaw.com

www.forbes.com

Did Pfizer Delay Covid Vaccine—As Trump Has Claimed? Here’s What We Know.

Trump has claimed the company delayed an announcement for its vaccine until after the 2020 presidential election.
www.forbes.com www.forbes.com

Old news from a year ago. Dr. Dormitzer has publicly and repeatedly stated that these allegations are part false in regards to moving to Canada and partly that the WSJ misinterpreted or falsely changed other statements about the vaccine timing.
 
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arthurdawg said:
arstechnica.com

Analysis of Texas measles outbreak shows just how dangerous virus is

About 1 in 5 cases were hospitalized and most of those developed complications.
arstechnica.com arstechnica.com
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No demographic information in this article. (I am shocked, shocked I say!) I wonder how common measles vaccinations are in central/south America. Considering the clustering of cases in Texas, I'm betting the underlying cause is more immigration shenanigans and less box-wine moms who read too much Facebook every day.
 
CrimsonJazz said:
No demographic information in this article. (I am shocked, shocked I say!) I wonder how common measles vaccinations are in central/south America. Considering the clustering of cases in Texas, I'm betting the underlying cause is more immigration shenanigans and less box-wine moms who read too much Facebook every day.
Click to expand...

There is a super conservative group of anti-vax mennonites in the area and that was the primary impetus for the outbreak and a majority of the cases were in that group, not the immigrant population. Mexico runs about 80-85% in terms of measles vax rates.

That is the big problem... By the 1990s the vast majority of all cases of measles were brought in by immigrants (more commonly from the Middle East and Asia than south of the border). But now, we have more cases caused by having unvaccinated populations here in the states.

Everyone focuses on the death rates of viruses, but the morbidity has to be taken into account. A 20% admission rate is costly and really is horrifying for the kids who are in the hospital being stuck and having to undergo procedures. Not too mention the longer term mortality increase from having the immune system essentially reset. Measles infections erases your bank of memory B-cells resulting in a higher risk of infection for years going forward and also a need to revaccinate... which is a problem when you are in an anti-vax family.
 
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arthurdawg said:
There is a super conservative group of anti-vax mennonites in the area and that was the primary impetus for the outbreak and a majority of the cases were in that group, not the immigrant population. Mexico runs about 80-85% in terms of measles vax rates.

That is the big problem... By the 1990s the vast majority of all cases of measles were brought in by immigrants (more commonly from the Middle East and Asia than south of the border). But now, we have more cases caused by having unvaccinated populations here in the states.

Everyone focuses on the death rates of viruses, but the morbidity has to be taken into account. A 20% admission rate is costly and really is horrifying for the kids who are in the hospital being stuck and having to undergo procedures. Not too mention the longer term mortality increase from having the immune system essentially reset. Measles infections erases your bank of memory B-cells resulting in a higher risk of infection for years going forward and also a need to revaccinate... which is a problem when you are in an anti-vax family.
Click to expand...
So a religious tribe? Hmmm, what makes these Mennonites different from the Mennonites and Quakers on the other end of the country who, as I understand it, don't do vaccines, either?

You seem to know more about this than the average bear, so here's my other question: why does it seem like measles was once more of an irritation than a serious (or somewhat serious) medical condition? Is it a mutation? The Mandela Effect? What?
 
arthurdawg said:
There is a super conservative group of anti-vax mennonites in the area and that was the primary impetus for the outbreak and a majority of the cases were in that group, not the immigrant population. Mexico runs about 80-85% in terms of measles vax rates.

That is the big problem... By the 1990s the vast majority of all cases of measles were brought in by immigrants (more commonly from the Middle East and Asia than south of the border). But now, we have more cases caused by having unvaccinated populations here in the states.

Everyone focuses on the death rates of viruses, but the morbidity has to be taken into account. A 20% admission rate is costly and really is horrifying for the kids who are in the hospital being stuck and having to undergo procedures. Not too mention the longer term mortality increase from having the immune system essentially reset. Measles infections erases your bank of memory B-cells resulting in a higher risk of infection for years going forward and also a need to revaccinate... which is a problem when you are in an anti-vax family.
Click to expand...
Thanks for mentioning the impact on your immune system. I'd wondered how many people knew that. I also wondered about what effect the actual disease had on us pre-vac kids...
 
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CrimsonJazz said:
So a religious tribe? Hmmm, what makes these Mennonites different from the Mennonites and Quakers on the other end of the country who, as I understand it, don't do vaccines, either?

You seem to know more about this than the average bear, so here's my other question: why does it seem like measles was once more of an irritation than a serious (or somewhat serious) medical condition? Is it a mutation? The Mandela Effect? What?
Click to expand...

Measles is only considered an irritation because of vaccination.

Prior to vaccination the US had several million cases per year, 500 direct deaths, several thousand indirect deaths, and thousand were left neurologically injured for life. Multiply similar numbers over the other vaccines and you can see that there was a substantial morbidity and mortality prior to vaccinations. Add the effect of antibiotics and definitely modern sanitation and the triad has saved countless lives. There are estimates on the lives saved and the illness and pain averted and it is amazing what we have been able to accomplish. Stable nutrition also played a major role in TB control and across the board with the other advances.

Measles advanced around the world with colonial efforts and devastated the populations that were freshly exposed. Hawaii has a well documented history and approximately 25% of the population died when measles was introduced. We are fortunate that we live downstream of the widespread measles epidemics that largely killed the susceptible.

As a reminder... The measles vaccine is 97% effective and generally quite well tolerated. There are no proven cases of fatal vaccine injury associated with it and it is rare to have severe effects. Most of those who do get sick have occult immune deficiencies. If we vaccinated fully around the world, since measles only exists in humans... Measles could join smallpox as an extinct virus.
 
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arthurdawg said:
Measles is only considered an irritation because of vaccination.

Prior to vaccination the US had several million cases per year, 500 direct deaths, several thousand indirect deaths, and thousand were left neurologically injured for life. Multiply similar numbers over the other vaccines and you can see that there was a substantial morbidity and mortality prior to vaccinations. Add the effect of antibiotics and definitely modern sanitation and the triad has saved countless lives. There are estimates on the lives saved and the illness and pain averted and it is amazing what we have been able to accomplish. Stable nutrition also played a major role in TB control and across the board with the other advances.

Measles advanced around the world with colonial efforts and devastated the populations that were freshly exposed. Hawaii has a well documented history and approximately 25% of the population died when measles was introduced. We are fortunate that we live downstream of the widespread measles epidemics that largely killed the susceptible.

As a reminder... The measles vaccine is 97% effective and generally quite well tolerated. There are no proven cases of fatal vaccine injury associated with it and it is rare to have severe effects. Most of those who do get sick have occult immune deficiencies. If we vaccinated fully around the world, since measles only exists in humans... Measles could join smallpox as an extinct virus.
Click to expand...
We can't tolerate fiends like the Kennedys.
 
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