What is the reason for no toss sweeps?

[Dinkin_Flicka]

I know there's been a lot of discussion on the running game, and why we don't try different things, but is there a consensus on why we don't try to get to the edge quickly by using the toss? Seems like I've seen us do it about 3 times this year. If I remember correctly, we ran it once in the 3rd qtr against MSU, and it went for maybe 4 yds or so, which was, unfortunately, one of our better plays that day. Then we never see it again...

Clearly Shula is trying to move the ball. There must be some reason that our staff is absolutely opposed to running this type of play, right (or at least opposed to running it more than once every few weeks)? Anyone have any idea what the thought process is here?

 

[ElkhartTider]

wow.... i think if we ran all toss sweeps all the time we would win every game all our problems would disappear

 

[Bama323]

Would you really want to run a toss sweep if you knew the DE was going to blow over your right tackle on half the plays of the game?

 

[Dinkin_Flicka]

wow.... i think if we ran all toss sweeps all the time we would win every game all our problems would disappear

uhhh, ok. My question was why we never tried something different, given that what we seem committed to running hasn't worked very well. I think this is different from saying "if we ran 1000 toss sweeps we'd beat OSU!!!!"

 

[Dinkin_Flicka]

Would you really want to run a toss sweep if you knew the DE was going to blow over your right tackle on half the plays of the game?

Very good point - in my mind all these sweeps are going left. All of them. Just like the one against MSU did.

 

[BamaFanOJ]

We should include more toss sweeps and stretch plays like the Colts. It works pretty well for them, but I don't know how it would work with our O-line.

 

[ElkhartTider]

do u guys really think that our staff is that dumb and ignorant?..

if there was a way that they could move the ball easier im sure they would have done it by now... especially w/ a play as common in football as the sweep!.... there is obviously a reason for us not doing the play as much as many of the fans would like...

 

[Dr. Van Nostran]

At least with a toss sweep the backs would be getting as far away from our O-Line as possible. That would have to be better than running towards our O-Line.

 

[Dinkin_Flicka]

do u guys really think that our staff is that dumb and ignorant?..

if there was a way that they could move the ball easier im sure they would have done it by now... especially w/ a play as common in football as the sweep!.... there is obviously a reason for us not doing the play as much as many of the fans would like...

That was exactly what I was asking. Clearly there is a reason they aren't doing it. Any idea what that reason is?

 

[ElkhartTider]

That was exactly what I was asking. Clearly there is a reason they aren't doing it. Any idea what that reason is?

the O-line is terrible?

 

[imauafan]

do u guys really think that our staff is that dumb and ignorant?..

if there was a way that they could move the ball easier im sure they would have done it by now... especially w/ a play as common in football as the sweep!.... there is obviously a reason for us not doing the play as much as many of the fans would like...

Let's test this theory, against UT in the first half Johns busted about 3 long plays and didn't touch the ball the rest of the game. Against MSU early on, Castille busts up the middle for some good gains and doesn't see the ball again (unless it was the jumbo package). Our coaching staff has proven time and time again that they have no concept of sticking with what is working at that moment and continually fall back to things that are not working (Darby up the middle).

 

[jwade11]

Their playcalling is terrible and predictable. I would like to see something different than the jumbo package inside the five yard line. I would love to see JJ. He is the most hard-nosed football player on the offensive side of the ball.

 

[Bama Lee]

the O-line is terrible?

I have seen other offensive lines very similar in performance to the one currently at Bama and they have still been able to move the ball. THe offensive we had during our National Championship season comes to mind! Sometimes you have to figure out how to develop plays within the parameters of the skills of your current athletes versus continuing to make them run your own plays developed for a completely different group.

 

[derek4tide]

I know there's been a lot of discussion on the running game, and why we don't try different things, but is there a consensus on why we don't try to get to the edge quickly by using the toss? Seems like I've seen us do it about 3 times this year. If I remember correctly, we ran it once in the 3rd qtr against MSU, and it went for maybe 4 yds or so, which was, unfortunately, one of our better plays that day. Then we never see it again...

Clearly Shula is trying to move the ball. There must be some reason that our staff is absolutely opposed to running this type of play, right (or at least opposed to running it more than once every few weeks)? Anyone have any idea what the thought process is here?

Does this clear it up?

We've thrown it, we've run it, we've play-action passed it, we've run nakeds and boots, we've run draws, we've run screens, we've run fades, we've run slants, we've done a variety of things," Rader said Saturday. "That's not to say we're grasping at straws. That's just what our offense allows us to do. I feel secure that nobody has sunk their teeth into what we're going to do."

- Tuesday, November 07, 2006 BHM news

 

[ElkhartTider]

I have seen other offensive lines very similar in performance to the one currently at Bama and they have still been able to move the ball. THe offensive we had during our National Championship season comes to mind! Sometimes you have to figure out how to develop plays within the parameters of the skills of your current athletes versus continuing to make them run your own plays developed for a completely different group.

where did u see these O-lines? high school?.....


im not talking about technique of the O-line.. im talking talent level and ability..


so your comparing our '92 O-line .. w/ our O-line of the present?

i was only 7 in '92 but for some reason i find that hard to believe..

 

[alatider]

Our coaching staff has proven time and time again that they have no concept of sticking with what is working at that moment and continually fall back to things that are not working (Darby up the middle).

You took the words right out of my mouth. This is why I continually throw stuff at my tv during every Bama (loss) game so far this year.

 

[nooneLT]

first our two backs' strength isn't on the outside. darby is more between the tackles back and relies on his cutting ability. johns is more of a power back and just duck down the shoulder and hit a hole. toss sweeps need a fast back that has explosive speed. especially in the SEC, the LB's are gonna be running at 4.5-6. if your back isn't that fast, it's gonna create an even worse loss.

and we run alot to the middle to set up play action. i actually like shula's playcalling between the 20's. sometimes you have to take a couple of no gains to set up a bigger play later. and i really haven't seen a lot of college teams run the stretch play.

 

[Littlewing]

Let's test this theory, against UT in the first half Johns busted about 3 long plays and didn't touch the ball the rest of the game. Against MSU early on, Castille busts up the middle for some good gains and doesn't see the ball again (unless it was the jumbo package). Our coaching staff has proven time and time again that they have no concept of sticking with what is working at that moment and continually fall back to things that are not working (Darby up the middle).

darby busted a few up the middle against msu.. but we definatley need to run more tosses.

 

[jthomas666]

do u guys really think that our staff is that dumb and ignorant?

Now is probably not the best time to be asking us that question.

 

[Bama Lee]

where did u see these O-lines? high school?.....


im not talking about technique of the O-line.. im talking talent level and ability..


so your comparing our '92 O-line .. w/ our O-line of the present?

i was only 7 in '92 but for some reason i find that hard to believe..

Did you watch that season? Our RB's had to turn sideways just to get a few yards. Jay Barker was pressured often. That line had a few good players just like this one. It also had some poor one just like this one. The difference was that the coaching staff new how to utilize it to their advantage. They also had a fantastic defense that scored almost as many points as the offense.