Bad News For People Who Hate Good News (economy added 243,000 jobs in January)

[MattinBama]

Re: Bad News For People Who Like Good News (economy added 243,000 jobs in January)

There is no way you or anyone else can provide anything, other than your opinions, to prove that we COULD be doing much better. I saw it every day, people not spending money because they were (and still are) nervous about the economy, and where our country is going. Nothing anyone would have or could have done would have made that feeling go away any quicker than it is, and when it comes down to it, that's whats driving the economy: people don't spend, it tanks.

I saw the same thing here. In the print industry most of our work suddenly dried up because a lot of companies scaled back their advertising budgets while just holding onto a wait & see pattern. From talking to different business owners from around Alabama, Georgia, etc most of the concern and not spending their money was because they were in a wait & see to find out just what the hell Obama was doing with the Healthcare bill, stimulus, etc and how it was going to impact everyone down the line. He basically single-handedly put a ton of businesses into the "we're not going to spend a dime while we wait to see how this shakes out" mode.

I think we could be doing much better than we are if not for his general ineptitude (such as making ignorant statements about ATM's, stock market) that kept people clutching onto their money living in fear. There are the issues with the housing market, the crap Bush did, etc. but for most of the business owners I've talked to it was Obama and his desire to ram through Healthcare while he still had Congress that kept them from spending money.

So while I can't prove that without Obama or just with Obama not trying to ram through his bills while the getting was good things would be better than they are now, I'd say its a pretty safe bet that it would have been.

 

[Bamaro]

Re: Bad News For People Who Like Good News (economy added 243,000 jobs in January)

B_D, looks like your revised title is certainly proving itself out in this thread so far.

 

[bamacon]

Re: Bad News For People Who Like Good News (economy added 243,000 jobs in January)

I have a different information set (which only points out that I think anyone can make numbers say what they want, even Santelli; where does that 87 or 89 million number he tosses around come from? I believe it's an estimate. If what I heard last night from a guy from "Macroeconmics (something or other)", that statement is incorrect. The drop in unemployment numbers was corroborated by random sampling (phone polling) of households which backed up the data, indicating that more people were actually working.
And the "Much Better" comment - well, Bama should not have let the who's cross the 50 even once in the BCSCG; how's that for a half-empty glass?
There is no way you or anyone else can provide anything, other than your opinions, to prove that we COULD be doing much better. I saw it every day, people not spending money because they were (and still are) nervous about the economy, and where our country is going. Nothing anyone would have or could have done would have made that feeling go away any quicker than it is, and when it comes down to it, that's whats driving the economy: people don't spend, it tanks.
I just "dropped out" of the work force, but my place is being taken by someone else who was unemployed, so it's a wash, numbers-wise. I am not off the grid entirely, but will be soon as I am not eligible for unemployment (self-employed, and if you start a business and it fails, well, shame on you - you don't get unemployment benefits because the business failing was your fault. You should not have started it.)
No one that I know of, left or right (except on here) is talking about a "Booming Obama recovery"; this may or may not be something that will continue, no one knows, and there are quite a few who think it won't continue. Frankly, with the Europe situation and now the Iranian situation about to reach critical mass, I don't see it continuing.

I'm referring to the 99ers who simply give up looking for work after unemployment runs out. When they are dropped from the unemployment rolls they are no longer counted as unemployed, hence the unemployment rate goes down. It is fundamentally dishonest to say that more jobs were added when the overall number of jobs continues declining. It's politics and it's an election year but it's still a lie any way you look at it. ALso, historically, when we come out of a recession growth is usually very high. 2%, 0.7, and 1% growth is simply unacceptable for our nation to sustain for very long without horrific consequences. It's great that 243K people found work and I'm happy for them but we need more and we need it for a long time and the evidence is very gloomy that that can happen under the given circumstances.

 

[MattinBama]

Re: Bad News For People Who Like Good News (economy added 243,000 jobs in January)

B_D, looks like your revised title is certainly proving itself out in this thread so far.

June 4, 2010
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politic...ows-economy-is-moving-in-the-right-direction/

ABC News’ Karen Travers reports: President Obama said this morning that the May jobs report is a "sign that our economy is getting stronger by the day." The Labor Department reported today that the nation added 431,000 jobs in May, the fifth consecutive month of job growth. Obama credited his administration’s policies for the turnaround from “an economy that was shrinking at a scary rate” in January 2009, to the current progress of a half a year of steady job growth. “What these numbers do mean though is that we're moving in the right direction,” he said. “The economic policies that we've put in place are working.” While touting the report as a positive sign for the nation’s economy, Obama did note that most of the jobs in the May report were created to complete the 2010 census and noted that they are temporary jobs that will only last until the fall.

June 2, 2010
http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/06/02/us-obama-economy-jobs-idUSTRE65157A20100602

(Reuters) - President Barack Obama on Wednesday said he believed that the upcoming May employment report would show strong growth in U.S. payrolls.

"We expect to see strong jobs growth in Friday's report," Obama said in a speech in Pittsburgh. "This economy is getting stronger by the day."

Private economists surveyed by Reuters predicted the report would show a huge rise of 513,000 in payroll employment, with the number boosted by government hiring for the once-a-decade U.S. Census.

Call me when this is more than some numbers fluke and the trend continues for months without it going right back to "Jobless claims go up again!"

Also if you actually read the thread you would see most of the people skeptical of this stating that they hope that it continues and are happy (yes, the opposite emotion that you are trying to ascribe to posters here) that jobs were added in January. I'm sorry that this doesn't fit in with your view of the more conservative leaning posters sitting around in our overalls spitting out our tobaccy and playing our banjos while we hope against hope that the "black Muslim man those liberals elected" fails miserably on every level.

For me personally I don't care who is the President or who is in Congress that much because ultimately I have very little say in the matter, I just want myself and everyone else to be able to get back to work.

 

[Bamaro]

Re: Bad News For People Who Like Good News (economy added 243,000 jobs in January)

Many of the November & December jobs were seasonal jobs that no longer exist, much like the adding of a ton of jobs back when the government hired a bajillion census workers (double checked, bajillion is the correct number).

But I believe these were preliminary numbers for January

 

[bamabake]

Economic growth? Nope, it's anemic.
Delivering a massive money-hemorrhaging entitlement program? Yep, and not something that should be celebrated.
Bailouts for your cronies that violate the rule of law? Yep. Again, not something that should be celebrated.

werd

 

[Tide1986]

Here's a report from April/May 2011 when the economy added a similar number of jobs (244,000):

Despite Gains, Faster Growth Needed to Close Massive Shortage of Openings and Bring Unemployment Rate Down

"Given the extraordinary jobs deficit, the rate of recent growth, though an improvement, remains troubling. Even if the economy replicated April’s increase of 244,000 jobs each month, the jobs gap would not fully close for six years. To recover the deficit in a shorter time period – say three years, or by April 2014 – the economy would still need to add over 398,000 jobs per month. That pace is far greater than anything we’ve seen in the recovery to date or even experienced during more robust periods," said Owens.

 

[Bama4Ever831]

Why is it that only conservatives and libertarians know anything about economics? You'd think all liberals found with an economics book were shot on sight or something?

:wink:

 

[swoop10]

Why is it that only conservatives and libertarians know anything about economics? You'd think all liberals found with an economics book were shot on sight or something?

:wink:

I'm not sure but why don't you do a study about it? That seems to be the liberal answer to everything else.

 

[Bama4Ever831]

I'm not sure but why don't you do a study about it? That seems to be the liberal answer to everything else.

But then everyone just say its a hoax anyway!

 

[Bodhisattva]

Why is it that only conservatives and libertarians know anything about economics? You'd think all liberals found with an economics book were shot on sight or something?

:wink:

To me it's not a left/right issue, it's a question of who calls the shots in the economy. Increasingly, the government is taking over. So, for those who like the idea of a lot of regulations and taxes and spending, I've been asking two questions. One, show me where the government activity in question is authorized by the Constitution. And two, once you satisfy the first hurdle, show me how the government spends money (or, in the case of regulations, forces the private sector to spend money) in a more efficient manner than if that money were left with the individual or business that earned it.

Today we have a system were everyone steals from everyone else. And that's bad economics.

 

[swoop10]

But then everyone just say its a hoax anyway!

Only if the study tends to pad liberal pockets like most liberal studies seem to do.

 

[bamacon]

To me it's a left / right issue because of which style of economy you prefer. I don't believe liberals don't know about economics but rather that they prefer a heavily regulated and controlled market over a free market. Liberals see govt as a positive, active force in the market whereas as others see it as a hindrance to activity. The laws of economics are very easy to see and understand but how you react to that evidence is heavily influenced by your overall view of the role of govt.

 

[Bama4Ever831]

To me it's a left / right issue because of which style of economy you prefer. I don't believe liberals don't know about economics but rather that they prefer a heavily regulated and controlled market over a free market. Liberals see govt as a positive, active force in the market whereas as others see it as a hindrance to activity. The laws of economics are very easy to see and understand but how you react to that evidence is heavily influenced by your overall view of the role of govt.

:wink: The laws of economics always work great on paper.

 

[Tide1986]

:wink: The laws of economics always work great on paper.

...especially paper from the U.S. Treasury.

 

[cbi1972]

To me it's a left / right issue because of which style of economy you prefer. I don't believe liberals don't know about economics but rather that they prefer a heavily regulated and controlled market over a free market. Liberals see govt as a positive, active force in the market whereas as others see it as a hindrance to activity. The laws of economics are very easy to see and understand but how you react to that evidence is heavily influenced by your overall view of the role of govt.

Not sure how anyone could dislike this unless they just don't like the way of the world.

 

[lazlohollyfeld]

:wink: The laws of economics always work great on paper.

1. Start a business
2. Hire employees (don't forget to be a gentle and benevolent boss and pay a good wage with good insurance)
3. Sell a product or service (if you build something you have to build it here)
4. Get back to us in 3 years and see if you have changed your mind

 

[Bama4Ever831]

Not sure how anyone could dislike this unless they just don't like the way of the world.

It actually was a mistake.

 

[Bama4Ever831]

1. Start a business
2. Hire employees (don't forget to be a gentle and benevolent boss and pay a good wage with good insurance)
3. Sell a product or service (if you build something you have to build it here)
4. Get back to us in 3 years and see if you have changed your mind

Actually I do own a company while being a student. Thanks for being condescending though!

 

[bamacon]

The Obama "recovery" is something I will never grasp because it doesn't exist. You can't do things that you know will stifle economic growth and then say those same policies are the reason the economy is doing better. It's kinda like having an in-grown toenail on one big toe that hurts, and then you take a hammer and whack the big toe on the other foot and proclaim that your in-grown toe feels better. You haven't done anything to alleviate the pain in the first toe its just muted because the other one hurts worse.

Overall jobs lost is still growing, inflation is still very real, housing prices and market suck. The jobs shell game is just taking the eyes off the underlying disaster that remains very real. Great technique for politicians but devastating for improving our nation's economic health.