Johnny Manziel investigated by NCAA (will miss first half vs Rice)

[im4uainva]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

IMO, aTm is being foolish. They need to give the NCAA a way out. The best way to do that is to voluntarily suspend Manziel for the first two games of the season for signing autographs for brokers who intended to profit from those signings. They do not need to admit to anything else, and the NCAA would likely accept that punishment and move on down the road. The NCAA does not want to punish Manziel, but they are being painted into a corner.

Does anyone really believe that sitting JFF out for the first two games will really hurt A&M?
Against who...(iirc), Rice and Sam Houston? If they are to punish A&M, they need to sit him out for the first three games at least. If they are to punish, JFF, then the first two games should suffice. I am expecting Bama to endeavor to inflict their own brand of punishment on JFF and A&M, and I don't think they want to miss the opportunity.

Roll Tide, Roll...A'ight!

 

[B1GTide]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

Does anyone really believe that sitting JFF out for the first two games will really hurt A&M?

That is the point - sit him when it will not hurt them and let the NCAA accept that punishment.

 

[jthomas666]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

Does anyone really believe that sitting JFF out for the first two games will really hurt A&M?
Against who...(iirc), Rice and Sam Houston? If they are to punish A&M, they need to sit him out for the first three games at least. If they are to punish, JFF, then the first two games should suffice. I am expecting Bama to endeavor to inflict their own brand of punishment on JFF and A&M, and I don't think they want to miss the opportunity.

Roll Tide, Roll...A'ight!

Won't hurt A&M, but it will hurt Manziel, as it will deprive him of two stat-padding opportunities, putting a serious dent in his repeat-Heisman hopes.

 

[TideEngineer08]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

Billy Liucci ‏@billyliucci 34m
Hearing that NCAA is doing all it can to inform A&M of its 'recommendation' ASAP...Aggie coaches are in an incredibly tough spot w/game prep

I disagree with him completely. B1GTide is right. Just suspend him for 2 games, let the ncaa accept it, and move on. But no, they are being belligerent like Auburn was. Maybe it works out for them just the same though.

 

[B1GTide]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

I disagree with him completely. B1GTide is right. Just suspend him for 2 games, let the ncaa accept it, and move on. But no, they are being belligerent like Auburn was. Maybe it works out for them just the same though.

I don't think it will. In the Cam Newton case, there was a "loophole" that needed to be closed. Common sense tells us what happened, but the evidence was not there (proof that money changed hands). All the NCAA had was evidence that Newton's father had shopped him - which was not against the rules at the time.

There is a very clear rule against signing for brokers. The NCAA has to punish Manziel.

 

[mikes12]

I don't think it will. In the Cam Newton case, there was a "loophole" that needed to be closed. Common sense tells us what happened, but the evidence was not there (proof that money changed hands). All the NCAA had was evidence that Newton's father had shopped him - which was not against the rules at the time.

There is a very clear rule against signing for brokers. The NCAA has to punish Manziel.

I think the sCam loophole was created to save face at the time. There was a national title on the line. If he'd been some second stringer with limited play time, they would've suspended him immediately.

 

[Highway59]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

Not to hijack thread and revive the long thread that dealt with improprieties involving scam newton and his recruitment, but there were bylaws that were ignored by ncaa and the sec. The one that got me was the sec ignoring its own bylaw.

SEC Bylaw 14.01.3.2 stated:

“If at any time before or after matriculation in a member institution a student-athlete or any member of his/her family receives or agrees to receive, directly or indirectly, any aid or assistance beyond or in addition to that permitted by the Bylaws of this Conference (except such aid or assistance as such student-athlete may receive from those persons on whom the student is naturally or legally dependent for support), such student- athlete shall be ineligible for competition in any intercollegiate sport within the Conference for the remainder of his/her college career.”


​

The NCAA ruled that, “According to facts of the case agreed upon by Auburn University and the NCAA enforcement staff, the student-athlete’s father and an owner of a scouting service worked together to actively market the student-athlete as a part of a pay-for-play scenario in return for Newton’s commitment to attend college and play football.”

So to me you see the willingness on the part of the governing body to ignore the conclusions that had been reached and agreed to by the parties involved, and rule in a way that ignored the bylaw and its intent. By their own bylaw, the sec should have ruled that cam would not be able to participate at any of the other conference schools.

They, the ncaa and sec, will be consistent in only one thing. Their inconsistency.:rolleye2:

 

[crimsonaudio]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

I disagree with him completely. B1GTide is right. Just suspend him for 2 games, let the ncaa accept it, and move on. But no, they are being belligerent like Auburn was. Maybe it works out for them just the same though.

I agree, I'm just reporting what an A&M insider is saying. A&M has made it clear they'll only do what they feel they HAVE to do, and theres a segment that believes that unless the NCAA declares him ineligible he will play.

I think they're playing with fire, as the NCAA has the ace in their hand (signing knowing someone will sell for profit) and if you thumb your nose at the NCAA's recommendation, you may further entice them (NCAA) to bring fire.

I do think he's correct in saying the coaches are in a tough spot wrt preparation as I think this decision is above Sumlin's 'pay grade'.

 

[crimsonaudio]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

That is the point - sit him when it will not hurt them and let the NCAA accept that punishment.

Ahh, but it will - practice speed ≠ game speed, and it will almost certainly make it impossible for him to repeat as Heisman winner - A&M has already stated the Heisman win netted them some $40m in revenue.

 

[crimsonaudio]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

Not to hijack thread and revive the long thread that dealt with improprieties involving scam newton and his recruitment, but there were bylaws that were ignored by ncaa and the sec. The one that got me was the sec ignoring its own bylaw.

Well, the problem is there's zero proof that $cam's dad accepted funds, so the NAA didn't ignore the bylaw, as it says nothing about soliciting funds...

Ridiculous, I know, but that was the NCAAs escape route.

 

[Chukker Veteran]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

I got a kick out of watching the aTm coach being questioned recently...his expression was priceless when they asked him directly how the aggie code of honor figured in with the Johnny Hancock deal.

He said he couldn't comment on that, but I could almost see him thinking some of these hardcore aggies actually believe this honor code is something beyond a cute slogan. To his credit he didn't laugh or even smile, he kept a true poker face.

 

[Highway59]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

Well, the problem is there's zero proof that $cam's dad accepted funds, so the NAA didn't ignore the bylaw, as it says nothing about soliciting funds...

Ridiculous, I know, but that was the NCAAs escape route.

Ok, maybe should have just addressed SEC role. But onto more important things. Who is the face on your new avatar that is replacing the Bear?

 

[cbi1972]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

Well, the problem is there's zero proof that $cam's dad accepted funds, so the NAA didn't ignore the bylaw, as it says nothing about soliciting funds...

Ridiculous, I know, but that was the NCAAs escape route.

It's hard to imagine a solicitation attempt that doesn't implicitly include agreement to receive illegal benefits.

 

[crimsonaudio]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

It's hard to imagine a solicitation attempt that doesn't implicitly include agreement to receive illegal benefits.

Oh, I agree - but my point is that no NCAA rule was directly violated, unlike Johnny Hangover's case. While I suspect he'll play all the games, the reality is that this case is different than $cam's - the NCAA has the smoking gun, should they desire to go after JH.

 

[JIB]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

September 14th is either going to be the greatest regular season payback game of my lifetime or the most frustrating loss in recent memory.

All or nothing.

I fear the latter.

 

[rgw]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

I think NCAA is setting up a long game here. They know that the Manziel family has the financial capacity to lawyer up and turn this into a mess for administrators in College Station and Indianapolis. They will not rule him ineligible this week nor will they pull the Cam Newton maneuver where they declare ineligibility followed by a near immediate reinstatement. The NCAA is going to play this where TAMU ultimately takes the fall on Manziel's actions. They will recommend to TAMU that Manziel be held out until further discovery can be made on the allegations. This avoids a Manziel lawsuit against the NCAA. TAMU will respond to the recommendation by deferring their judgement and playing Manziel. This avoids a Manziel lawsuit against TAMU.

The NCAA will then wait until Manziel declares for the NFL which doesn't seem long considering all his eligibility issues. Once he is gone, the NCAA reveals they have additional evidence which demonstrates that Manziel was indeed ineligible and TAMU went against their recommendation while playing him for the 2013 season. TAMU ultimately takes all the punishment, Manziel doesn't have his draft stock hurt by ineligibility, and the NCAA gets their pelt.

 

[TIDE-HSV]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

I find your new avatar deeply disturbing.

I thought it looked good. In fact, I suggested it...

 

[JIB]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

I think NCAA is setting up a long game here. They know that the Manziel family has the financial capacity to lawyer up and turn this into a mess for administrators in College Station and Indianapolis. They will not rule him ineligible this week nor will they pull the Cam Newton maneuver where they declare ineligibility followed by a near immediate reinstatement. The NCAA is going to play this where TAMU ultimately takes the fall on Manziel's actions. They will recommend to TAMU that Manziel be held out until further discovery can be made on the allegations. This avoids a Manziel lawsuit against the NCAA. TAMU will respond to the recommendation by deferring their judgement and playing Manziel. This avoids a Manziel lawsuit against TAMU.

The NCAA will then wait until Manziel declares for the NFL which doesn't seem long considering all his eligibility issues. Once he is gone, the NCAA reveals they have additional evidence which demonstrates that Manziel was indeed ineligible and TAMU went against their recommendation while playing him for the 2013 season. TAMU ultimately takes all the punishment, Manziel doesn't have his draft stock hurt by ineligibility, and the NCAA gets their pelt.

That's the most likely scenario though I doubt TAMU will face much of a punishment after the fact. Just look at what Oregon got.

There's also the change they just sit around and do nothing and close the case after the season and nothing ever really gets resolved.

 

[rgw]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

I think TAMU would probably get something similar to Oregon except in the case where Manziel leads them to a conference and/or national title.


They'll strip those titles so quick that you'd think they work at Sammy's

 

[ROCKEE]

Re: Manziel Expected "To be the starting quarterback against Rice"

BINGO

I think NCAA is setting up a long game here. They know that the Manziel family has the financial capacity to lawyer up and turn this into a mess for administrators in College Station and Indianapolis. They will not rule him ineligible this week nor will they pull the Cam Newton maneuver where they declare ineligibility followed by a near immediate reinstatement. The NCAA is going to play this where TAMU ultimately takes the fall on Manziel's actions. They will recommend to TAMU that Manziel be held out until further discovery can be made on the allegations. This avoids a Manziel lawsuit against the NCAA. TAMU will respond to the recommendation by deferring their judgement and playing Manziel. This avoids a Manziel lawsuit against TAMU.

The NCAA will then wait until Manziel declares for the NFL which doesn't seem long considering all his eligibility issues. Once he is gone, the NCAA reveals they have additional evidence which demonstrates that Manziel was indeed ineligible and TAMU went against their recommendation while playing him for the 2013 season. TAMU ultimately takes all the punishment, Manziel doesn't have his draft stock hurt by ineligibility, and the NCAA gets their pelt.