Chris Low and Andy Staples on3 article - Early in KDB’s tenure, real concerns are surfacing in Tuscaloosa.

[RollTide_HTTR]

I think he likely needs to go but I'm not out on him completely. Optimism is too much to ask of me though. He has at least the rest of this season to convince all of us. Hopefully we come out angry in this weekend.

 

[tusks_n_raider]

I think he likely needs to go but I'm not out on him completely. Optimism is too much to ask of me though. He has at least the rest of this season to convince all of us. Hopefully we come out angry in this weekend.

He fooled me once and then twice but not thrice.

I’m not falling for it anymore.

I’m getting madder by the day.

I KNEW that OU game was a bad game omen and so many kept saying that they didn’t care ultimately because they were giving him a complete mulligan for the year.

Even after getting beat by Mich’s backups..

Mulligan

No… no mulligans.

The team looks like they do because apparently they can do whatever they want and they get endless mulligans.

Their has been no accountability from the players to the HC and no accountability from the HC to the University, The AD, The BOT, The Alumni, The former players, The fans… nobody.

Where we are right now is everyone’s fault.

We all should have been this upset after OU but especially after Mich.

If he doesn’t get his act together and go 10-1 the rest of the way and make the CFBP then BYE.

He’s worn his welcome with me by a long shot.

I might be the one to start the Go Fund Me for that buyout and I’m dead serious.

 

[NoNC4Tubs]

As for Lanning, if he can't win a NC at Oregon pretty soon, I think he'd consider a move back to the SEC or B1G. If he's wired right, he knows great coaches are measured in championships rather than bank accounts.

He's already in the B1g...

 

[BamaMoon]

He's already in the B1g...

Proof it's hard to keep up with how fast things have changed!

 

[jashleyren2]

True, lucky for Steele mental toughness and relentless pursuit were still a thing in Tuscaloosa. Seems we are in the prima donna softy era in T-town thanks to this regime.

I think we are the first big blue chip program to go down during this new era of college sports. It’ll sink in at other places too, eventually. It’s coming for Columbus, it’s coming for Austin, it’s coming for Miami, again.

 

[jashleyren2]

I really hope I’m wrong, but I don’t see DeBoer turning this around, even if he got a third year. He had eight months to make improvements and what we saw on the field Saturday were the same exact problems we saw last year, if not even worse. There’s no way he could have not known last year was unacceptable to the fanbase, yet here we are. Even after the game, he has to know his next press conference will likely be the most important and most watched of his career, and instead of looking prepared and focused, he’s stammering and looks confused. If he can’t even be bothered to take a few minutes to gather himself and anticipate likely questions for a less than ten minute presser, he’s probably not going to do what needs to be done to have his assistants and players ready for the rest of the season. I wouldn’t be surprised to see the team look better Saturday, but then another drop off for Wisconsin because he just hasn’t given any indication he can do better up to this point.

I tend to agree. Year 2 isn’t going to go well. Schedule is rough, and we play at a resurgent, odd year Auburn. That’s going to be a tough task. Year 3 may not look like great improvement either, and that will be the end of the patience an impatient fan base will have.

 

[lowend]

I think we are the first big blue chip program to go down during this new era of college sports. It’ll sink in at other places too, eventually. It’s coming for Columbus, it’s coming for Austin, it’s coming for Miami, again.

I think we're going to see the top of college football split into three tiers: the ones with lots of money, the ones with some money & tradition/history of success, and the also rans.

The top monied tier is going to made up of a much smaller number of schools that don't really fit together but want to spend massive money on players (think OSU, Texas, Oregon, but also SMU & Miami type teams).

The second tier is where Alabama, Florida, USC, etc. will fit. We have everything in place, except the finances to afford top tier players. We're not there yet, but we will be. This will also cost us top tier coaches. We'll be able to still get decent players; we might be able to knock off some of those top teams, but our days of being dominant forces are over.

The third tier will be the largest. These are teams with no money, no tradition, no facilities. These teams used to be FCS or at the bottom of FBS. These are the land grant schools, directional schools, etc.

 

[CaliforniaTide]

I'm not ready to give up on CKD yet, but if enough time passes and we need a new HC, D. Ryans would be one at the top of my list.

I don't know if he'd leave the NFL, but he could be one of those "mama called" coaches who might listen.

DeMeco doesn't strike me as someone that wants to coach in college, at least now. He was fantastic as an assistant coach and DC for the 49ers, and I was sad to see him leave for Houston. I understood why he did, but I was still sad. Head coaching in the NFL seems to be a bit more finicky than in college, so maybe if he's fired from Houston, he'll consider it.

 

[81usaf92]

I don't recall Saban being lauded as the next big thing when he went from MSU to LSU. Granted, I was a middle schooler at the time, but I remember him considered a possible coaching talent due to the MSU win over OSU, and how gritty MSU was as a team.

My point is that looking for that next "coach" is extremely difficult, and possibly impossible. LSU was looking for someone to do better than DiNardo, and they definitely got that in Saban, but I'm not sure they were seeing the new standard of LSU football when they hired him.

These booster comments are discouraging for me, primarily b/c this was NEVER reported under Saban. I'm more annoyed that they're public comments now. If your picture is in some booster HoF, you have enough clout/ego to put your name with the comment. I understand having these comments behind closed doors, but it changes when being made in public.

After he got beat by UAB I don’t think many thought he would be the “next” anything but “the next LSU coach to get fired”.

 

[TideEngineer08]

After he got beat by UAB I don’t think many thought he would be the “next” anything but “the next LSU coach to get fired”.

And then he coached LSU to its first win against Alabama in Baton Rouge in 30 years (thanks Mike DuBose) and the rest, as they say, is history.

 

[Valley View]

I know the fish rots from the head down, but the players are the ones who actually make (or don't make) plays on the field. I saw a lack of effort from many players against FSU. Against LM it looked like a different team, not because of the score, but the effort, discipline, and enthusiasm were much more prominent.

 

[Valley View]

I don't know what the next "Saban" results will look like with the new landscape of college football. I highly doubt it's 6 NC's and 15 years of dominance. I still think the teams that are able to recruit, develop, and retain will be at the top. Money may get them there, but as this plays on, I think we're going to see that recruiting and development are still going to be pillars of championship teams.

With the NIL and transfer portal I'm not sure if there will ever be another Saban. Developing players does not pay off as in the past because they can (and do) leave at any time. Same with the NIL, another team offers more money and there goes that player you spent 2 1/2 years developing.

 

[KrAzY3]

I know the fish rots from the head down, but the players are the ones who actually make (or don't make) plays on the field. I saw a lack of effort from many players against FSU. Against LM it looked like a different team, not because of the score, but the effort, discipline, and enthusiasm were much more prominent.

I don't think I've ever heard a general blame the soldiers for a lost battle. The reason is simple, because ultimately the preparation for those soldiers falls on him. The choice of how to utilize those soldiers lies on him, the strategy and so on falls on him. You don't blame a chess piece because it can't do what you want it to do, you use a chess piece knowing the limitations it has.

In this case, I always felt like Lank/Milroe took a lot of heat off of the staff, and obscured some of their mistakes. For instance, against Vanderbilt the coaches sent out two players with the same number on. Alabama was getting the ball back, instead it resulted in a Vanderbilt touchdown which was the difference in the game. That was 100% on coaching, not the players, not Lank, that loss was the result of a coaching blunder. You will never win championships making mistakes like that. I'm not even sure whose fault it was because as far as I'm aware I never heard any coach publicaly take accountability for it.

That would be how you show leadership though, say it was my fault, I take responsibility. Then there was the Michigan game. Alabama had plenty of time to prepare and Michigan was playing with their backups. Alabama didn't even have the right cleats on! Their slipping all over the place ended at least two Alabama drives, and it was a single score game! You can't do that at this level, you can't prepare your players to poorly they're not even wearing the right shoes!

Then we get to FSU, and yes I agree it was lack of effort, and discipline but who instills the discipline? Whose job is it to motivate them?

I sure hope that the team has turned a corner, they desperately need to. I was never of the opinion this was going to be a 3 win team or something, but rather I feared another year with championship talent was going to go wasted by missing the playoffs. Alabama started off last year beating Western Kentucky 63-0, and also beating Wisconsin and Georgia, so the truth is we might not know for some time if the coaching has improved or not. What I do know is it darn sure needed to improve.

 

[Rockettman]

Alabama didn't even have the right cleats on! Their slipping all over the place ended at least two Alabama drives, and it was a single score game! You can't do that at this level, you can't prepare your players to poorly they're not even wearing the right shoes!

I think this is one of the biggest areas that will be missed from Saban. His preparation for anything and everything that may happen during a game was next level.

 

[NoNC4Tubs]

I don't think I've ever heard a general blame the soldiers for a lost battle. The reason is simple, because ultimately the preparation for those soldiers falls on him. The choice of how to utilize those soldiers lies on him, the strategy and so on falls on him. You don't blame a chess piece because it can't do what you want it to do, you use a chess piece knowing the limitations it has.

I don't think Generals deal with a "lack of effort", after all their very lives are at stake so it absolutely falls on the strategy and preparation by the General and his staff.

'Nuff said or this gets sent to another board...

 

[KrAzY3]

I don't think Generals deal with a "lack of effort", after all their very lives are at stake so it absolutely falls on the strategy and preparation by the General and his staff.

Soldiers do quit quite often (which is the ultimate lack of effort). Desertion, surrendering (in some cases justified but at times actively seeking out people to surrender to), etc...

Some estimates have Union desertion rates as high as 25% during the Civil War. There have even been soldiers who deliberately injured themselves as a means to get out of a war.

I belabor the point not to argue, but morale is a important thing in combat.The definition is an interesting one: "the confidence, enthusiasm, and discipline of a person or group at a particular time". That certainly applies to Alabama for the FSU game.

I'm speaking in general not necessarily to you but the point you made was interesting enough to consider.

I can't recall who said it, but I heard one quote from a player or coach after the FSU game who essentially said the players had low morale or as they put it "here we go again" (expectation of another bad result). For years, making the other team have low morale, "make them quit" was the goal.

Morale is important in anything that is especially demanding. Football is hard, you get hit, you have to exert yourself, it's a contact sport. If you're not enthusiastic, if you're not disciplined, if you're not confident, you are much, much more likely to fail. If there is a leadership structure, it is their job to instill those things in you and give you the best opportunity to succeed. When they're lacking, it's a failure of leadership.

 

[JDCrimson]

Not sure how or why, but around 2021 2022, we started hearing the word anxiety in the lockerroom being talked about in PCs, but that has persisted to this day. I think it generally followed the decline in performance of the OL. I honestly believe the hiring of Marrone broke the confident psyche of our program. The wizardry of Bryce covered over some severe issues. And I think this decision begat Milroe as our starting QB later, emergence of LANK, and ultimately Saban's retirement and Deboer being held hostage last year. So in reflecting this was a 5yr dynasty ending decision.

Someone could write a book about this swan era of Saban.

Soldiers do quit quite often (which is the ultimate lack of effort). Desertion, surrendering (in some cases justified but at times actively seeking out people to surrender to), etc...

Some estimates have Union desertion rates as high as 25% during the Civil War. There have even been soldiers who deliberately injured themselves as a means to get out of a war.

I belabor the point not to argue, but morale is a important thing in combat.The definition is an interesting one: "the confidence, enthusiasm, and discipline of a person or group at a particular time". That certainly applies to Alabama for the FSU game.

I'm speaking in general not necessarily to you but the point you made was interesting enough to consider.

I can't recall who said it, but I heard one quote from a player or coach after the FSU game who essentially said the players had low morale or as they put it "here we go again" (expectation of another bad result). For years, making the other team have low morale, "make them quit" was the goal.

Morale is important in anything that is especially demanding. Football is hard, you get hit, you have to exert yourself, it's a contact sport. If you're not enthusiastic, if you're not disciplined, if you're not confident, you are much, much more likely to fail. If there is a leadership structure, it is their job to instill those things in you and give you the best opportunity to succeed. When they're lacking, it's a failure of leadership.

 

[KrAzY3]

Not sure how or why, but around 2021 2022, we started hearing the word anxiety in the lockerroom being talked about in PCs, but that has persisted to this day. I think it generally followed the decline in performance of the OL. I honestly believe the hiring of Marrone broke the confident psyche of our program. The wizardry of Bryce covered over some severe issues. And I think this decision begat Milroe as our starting QB later, emergence of LANK, and ultimately Saban's retirement and Deboer being held hostage last year. So in reflecting this was a 5yr dynasty ending decision.

Someone could write a book about this swan era of Saban.

Once I started thinking about the military analogy, I couldn't get it out of my head. Last year I was saying it was a discipline issue, and that's part of the problem but once I started thinking in terms of morale things all fell into place for me. it encapsulates most of the issues.

It is also worth noting that Scott Cochran left the program in 2019, and it's fairly easy to say he was the standard bearer. A role that was at the same time, everything and nothing.They didn't fight, they are often ceremonial, but to the Romans for instance they were still considered vital, and the standard bearer could turn the tide of battle.

I posted elsewhere that Alabama needed a Scott Cochran type, but I wasn't quite putting my finger on what that entailed. Consider this though, both Georgia championships, and all but one Alabama championship came with Cochran on the sideline. Perhaps he did more for morale, and conversely morale was more important for success than any of us realized.

Once I accept this premise, that Alabama in fact has a low morale problem a lot of other pieces fall into place. Why wouldn't their morale lower once Nick Saban left? I mean Saban literally quit on them right? I wanted Dabo over DeBoer but my justification was kind of vague, I felt like the recruits would know him better, be more familiar and in turn be more enthusiastic. That's another way to say their morale would be higher.

Saban leaves, then the options the players hear publicly floated include Lanning, Sark, Kiffin, Dabo and DeBoer. These SEC kids who dreamed of playing for Saban obviously would be hurt once he left, but with those first four names odds are they were recruited by and/or were at games with them coaching on the sidelines. They'd know who those guys were and I imagine they were hoping for one of them purely due to familiarity. Instead they get the guy they don't know anything about, and subsequently the morale takes another hit.

This isn't necessarily all bad though, because if there is indeed a low morale problem, which I think there seems to be, that means it might be easier to fix than some systemic problem. It has been noted that the guys that came from Washington seem to be playing better, and once you consider morale, why wouldn't they? They wanted to play for DeBoer, they chose him, so their morale will be higher.

This won't necessarily fix everything, a standard bearer doesn't double your military might or something, but it means if the coaches can figure out how to address the issue of low morale it might fix some of those issues with discipline and motivation.

 

[bamajas]

Once I started thinking about the military analogy, I couldn't get it out of my head. Last year I was saying it was a discipline issue, and that's part of the problem but once I started thinking in terms of morale things all fell into place for me. it encapsulates most of the issues.

It is also worth noting that Scott Cochran left the program in 2019, and it's fairly easy to say he was the standard bearer. A role that was at the same time, everything and nothing.They didn't fight, they are often ceremonial, but to the Romans for instance they were still considered vital, and the standard bearer could turn the tide of battle.

I posted elsewhere that Alabama needed a Scott Cochran type, but I wasn't quite putting my finger on what that entailed. Consider this though, both Georgia championships, and all but one Alabama championship came with Cochran on the sideline. Perhaps he did more for morale, and conversely morale was more important for success than any of us realized.

Once I accept this premise, that Alabama in fact has a low morale problem a lot of other pieces fall into place. Why wouldn't their morale lower once Nick Saban left? I mean Saban literally quit on them right? I wanted Dabo over DeBoer but my justification was kind of vague, I felt like the recruits would know him better, be more familiar and in turn be more enthusiastic. That's another way to say their morale would be higher.

Saban leaves, then the options the players hear publicly floated include Lanning, Sark, Kiffin, Dabo and DeBoer. These SEC kids who dreamed of playing for Saban obviously would be hurt once he left, but with those first four names odds are they were recruited by and/or were at games with them coaching on the sidelines. They'd know who those guys were and I imagine they were hoping for one of them purely due to familiarity. Instead they get the guy they don't know anything about, and subsequently the morale takes another hit.

This isn't necessarily all bad though, because if there is indeed a low morale problem, which I think there seems to be, that means it might be easier to fix than some systemic problem. It has been noted that the guys that came from Washington seem to be playing better, and once you consider morale, why wouldn't they? They wanted to play for DeBoer, they chose him, so their morale will be higher.

This won't necessarily fix everything, a standard bearer doesn't double your military might or something, but it means if the coaches can figure out how to address the issue of low morale it might fix some of those issues with discipline and motivation.

Not to mention that all the resources and perks of coming to Bama, they would be ecstatic about. whereas the Saban-era players and local-ish recruits are already familiar with and more prone to complacency about being here. When Bernard or Brailsford were in HS, would they have ever seen a path to have ended up here?

Good reflections, could be something here. Cochran's presence on 7/8 NCs is wild

 

[BamaMoon]

Not sure how or why, but around 2021 2022, we started hearing the word anxiety in the lockerroom being talked about in PCs, but that has persisted to this day. I think it generally followed the decline in performance of the OL. I honestly believe the hiring of Marrone broke the confident psyche of our program. The wizardry of Bryce covered over some severe issues. And I think this decision begat Milroe as our starting QB later, emergence of LANK, and ultimately Saban's retirement and Deboer being held hostage last year. So in reflecting this was a 5yr dynasty ending decision.

Someone could write a book about this swan era of Saban.

Good recap and timeline of those events.

I wonder how much Covid was involved this? I also wonder how much of the "anxiety" is generated by social media?

I saw where Arch Manning has basically narrowed his social media presence to family only. Smart move.