How about a 12 plus 2 College Football Playoff?

How is Sagarin one of the worst models?

Virtually every time anyone makes an appeal to a computer on this board, it's Sagarin.

And btw - I'm not even disagreeing with you, I have to know more where you're coming from to see what you mean. I just threw out a well-known name and they tend to rank far more reasonably than the Twittie Committee has.

And as a reminder: it was the fact we had six computers in 2003 that left Oklahoma at #1 and gave us the wrong national title game. As long as people are willing to accept THAT PARTICULAR PROBLEM (which with 8 teams shouldn't be as much a problem except for the fact the #1 seed is supposed to have an advantage), it's OK. Oklahoma should have fallen in 2003, but they wouldn't have fallen below #8 even in the strictest computer model.

When comparing computer models, other than “eye test”, which I’ll touch on later, one of the few objective ways you can compare for empirical accuracy is to look at how many times each model’s ranking violates actual outcomes on the field. Example: having Alabama ranked above Florida State would be considered a violation since FSU beat Bama head to head. Of course, this particular violation is one that any decent model should be guilty of, since obviously, Bama is an objectively better team. So all models will have some violations. But in general, since better teams usually win against worse teams in head to head matchups, the better computer models will minimize violations of head to head outcomes.

With that in mind, we can look at the list of models and their violation counts maintained by Kenneth Massey at https://masseyratings.com/ranks?s=cf&top=-1 . Of the 86 models listed, Sagarin ranks 75th in terms of fewest violations among the top 25 FBS teams, 57th when considering ALL FBS teams. That’s pretty horrible.

Now to eye test… here’s sagarin’s CURRENT top 25:

1. Ohio State
2. Indiana
3. Notre Dame
4. Oregon
5. Texas Tech
6. Georgia
7. Miami
8. Texas A&M
9. Alabama
10. Mississippi
11. Vanderbilt
12. Texas
13. Oklahoma
14. Penn State
15. Utah
16. Iowa
17. USC
18. Washington
19. Missouri
20. SMU
21. Tennessee
22. Michigan
23. LSU
24. BYU
25. Clemson

You tell me. Considering where he’s ranking teams like Notre Dame, Miami, Penn State, and Clemson (you could argue for others as well), do Sagarin’s rankings pass the eye test? To me, they don’t. I’m not a big fan of “eye test” though, which is why I’ll hang my hat on the ranking violation metric. By that metric, there’s about 10-20 different rankings that stand out above the other 70. But even most of the bad models outperform Sagarin.

He gets all the mentions because he was one of the first in the game, and certainly the most widely known among the pioneers of computer rankings, having signed a deal with USA Today and published by them every week starting around 1985.
 
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When comparing computer models, other than “sight test”, which I’ll touch on later, one of the few objective ways you can compare for empirical accuracy is to look at how many times each model’s ranking violates actual outcomes on the field. Example: having Alabama ranked above Florida State would be considered a violation since FSU beat Bama head to head. Of course, this particular violation is one that any decent model should be guilty of, since obviously, Bama is an objectively better team. So all models will have some violations. But in general, since better teams usually win against worse teams in head to head matchups, the better computer models will minimize violations of head to head outcomes.

With that in mind, we can look at the list of models and their violation counts maintained by Kenneth Massey at https://masseyratings.com/ranks?s=cf&top=-1 . Of the 86 models listed, Sagarin ranks 75th in terms of fewest violations among the top 25 FBS teams, 57th when considering ALL FBS teams. That’s pretty horrible.

Now to sight test… here’s sagarin’s CURRENT top 25:

1. Ohio State
2. Indiana
3. Notre Dame
4. Oregon
5. Texas Tech
6. Georgia
7. Miami
8. Texas A&M
9. Alabama
10. Mississippi
11. Vanderbilt
12. Texas
13. Oklahoma
14. Penn State
15. Utah
16. Iowa
17. USC
18. Washington
19. Missouri
20. SMU
21. Tennessee
22. Michigan
23. LSU
24. BYU
25. Clemson

You tell me. Considering where he’s ranking teams like Notre Dame, Miami, Penn State, and Clemson (you could argue for others as well), do Sagarin’s rankings pass the sight test? To me, they don’t. I’m not a big fan of “sight test” though, which is why I’ll hang my hat on the ranking violation metric. By that metric, there’s about 10-20 different rankings that stand out above the other 70. But even most of the bad models outperform Sagarin.

He gets all the mentions because he was one of the first in the game, and certainly the most widely known among the pioneers of computer rankings, having signed a deal with USA Today and published by them every week starting around 1985.
Dang! I need your betting slips!
 
The B1G wants 24 teams playoff and eliminating the conference championship games. I guess the plan would be 8 teams with a bye. So the team ranked 24 would have to win 5 games to be champion. Basically another half season.

Ridiculous.
 
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I expect we will have a 16 team playoff this year. With the conference championship games, it's very likely two teams will play 5 post season games.
 
While I understand the reasoning behind including the two Group of Five teams, it really seems like it's not the best twelve teams. How about having two play your way in Wild card games? This would consist of the two Group of Five top two teams, playing the number 11 and 12th ranked teams. This year it would be James Madison at Notre Dame, and Tulane at BYU. The winner of each game moves into the final 12 playoff teams.
I disagree.
If we have a 12 team playoff or a 16 team playoff,
I want the playoffs to be the top teams.

I'm against giving spots to conference champions of any stripe.
I'm also against giving anyone a BYE.
When the playoffs start they include everyone in the playoff...

Yes, my idea is to eliminate all conference championship games. Under the current playoff system the conference championship games has outlived it's usefulness.
 
Why stop there? I propose that when teams play all throughout the year, if the winning teams is ranked lower, then they swap rankings. For example, if Georgia is #7 and they beat #1 Ohio State, then Georgia becomes #1 and OSU becomes #7, and so on.
 
My understanding is that they have until tomorrow (January 23) to make any changes or the format remains the same for 2026.
 
Why stop there? I propose that when teams play all throughout the year, if the winning teams is ranked lower, then they swap rankings. For example, if Georgia is #7 and they beat #1 Ohio State, then Georgia becomes #1 and OSU becomes #7, and so on.
obviously there is never a true champion until they have played notre dame.
 
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