AZ To Require Birth Certificate to Be On Ballot?

Displaced Bama Fan

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Knee jerk? Really? Its been two years. Just produce the original/certified birth certificate. Really, it's only just a little Constitutional requirement. It would be so much easier to shut everyone up. Even Chris Matthews has called for him to show it.
 
Knee jerk? Really? Its been two years. Just produce the original/certified birth certificate. Really, it's only just a little Constitutional requirement. It would be so much easier to shut everyone up. Even Chris Matthews has called for him to show it.
Because you and I both know if he did come out and produce his original birth certificate, it would not shut everyone up.

And, as it's been said many times before, if the Republican National Committee thought he was an ineligible candidate... they would have filled every lawsuit imaginable to keep him off the ballot before the election. They obviously didn't have any issue with it.
 

GreatMarch

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Dec 10, 2010
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There are so many theories about this:

The man was not born in the US
The man was born in the US but has a different name on his birth certificate, thus disqualifing the last election
The man was born here but applied for and received financial aid in college as a foreign born student thus committing a felony and disqualifing him for the office.
and BLAH, BLAH, BLAH

I do find it humerous that the new Governor of Hawaii (who is a friend of the family) says he is going to release the info to shut everyone up and instead puts this out into the mainstream because he admits they can find no official state record. Good grief, not sure if this is becoming comocal or sad.
 

twofbyc

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I don't know if he was born here or not. Used to think he was, but don't know why I did. Just assumed I guess. This Hawaii governor stuff has sotra got me wondering. I don't understand why it is so crazy to think he might not have been.
Maybe this will help (maybe not, but i will make the attempt):
Hawaii has a state law forbidding the release of private information, such as birth certificates(so, no, even the Governor cannot release Obama's BC without violating that law; I would guess Obama could override that.).
#hawaii.gov/health/vital-record...
"State law prohibits the DOH for disclosing any information about a Hawaii vital record unless the requestor has a direct and tangible interest in the record. This includes verification of vital records and all the information contained in a record. Vital records disclosure laws protect all birth, death, marriage and divorce records held by the department and all amendments, changes, supporting records, and requests related to vital records."
October 31, 2008
Statement from Dr. Chiyome Fukino:
"I as Director of Health for the State of Hawaii, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."
The above have satisfied McCain, Boehner, McConnell and everyone in Congress except the birthers; as much as I don't really like any of them, I'm going to believe Hawaii's Director of Health. If you or anyone else chooses not to, that's your choice. It's a free country.
 
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Nate Harris

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Dec 7, 2003
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If Arizona passes this bill it will be unconstitutional on its face. Here's why.


U.S. Constitution, Article 4, Section 1 (also known as the Full, Faith & Credit Clause):

"Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state. And the Congress may by general laws prescribe the manner in which such acts, records, and proceedings shall be proved, and the effect thereof."
This means that Congress, and not the state of Arizona, has the sole authority to set the procedure for determining the validity of a birth certificate. Congress set that procedure in the United States Code, Title 28, Part 5, Chapter 115, Section 1739 (and I quote)...

State and Territorial nonjudicial records; full faith and credit

"All nonjudicial records or books kept in any public office of any State, Territory, or Possession of the United States, or copies thereof, shall be proved or admitted in any court or office in any other State, Territory, or Possession by the attestation of the custodian of such records..."
United States Code: Title 28,1739. State and Territorial nonjudicial records; full faith and credit | LII / Legal Information Institute


That means that if the State of Hawaii officially declares itself to be in possession of a valid birth certificate then all other states are required by the Constitution to take them at their word and recognize it as legally binding in every way. Furthermore, the Supreme Court affirmed the constitutional validity of this procedure in the case of Mills v. Duryee (1813).

What it all means for the question of Obama's birth certificate is that if you're going to demand more than just Hawaii's word for it then you have to change the federal law I quoted above. Arizona has no authority to alter the procedure in any way because Congress has sole authority to set it. Until that federal law is changed, Arizona and all other states are required to accept it. If Arizona tries to enforce any law such as the one proposed here then all Obama would need to do is request an injunction in federal court blocking its enforcement. As a strict matter of constitutional law this is absolutely uncontroversial in any way and his request would be immediately granted.

If you want to see Obama's original birth certificate the only way to do it is to get Congress to pass a new law requiring it to be done that way. Otherwise, you're out of luck.
 
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Nate Harris

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Problem is, the states get to determine how elections are certified. So Arizona's legislature/secretary of state could refuse to count ballots that contain a vote for a person deemed ineligible by the state to proceed. The legislature would then empower the electors of the other candidate. Constitutional crisis? Yeah, little bit.

More than just a little bit. You're basically saying that when a candidate for president has followed the specific constitutional procedure to establish his right to run for the office a state may still bar his name from appearing on the ballot. You know better than that.
 

Nate Harris

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BamainBoston,

You're forgetting the 9th amendment.

"The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."
The right of a state to set policy for its electors cannot be construed to deny the right of a person to run for president. These two rights are separate and distinct and one cannot cancel the other in any way. You know this very well.
 

NationalTitles18

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May 25, 2003
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October 31, 2008
Statement from Dr. Chiyome Fukino:
"I as Director of Health for the State of Hawaii, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."
The above have satisfied McCain, Boehner, McConnell and everyone in Congress except the birthers; as much as I don't really like any of them, I'm going to believe Hawaii's Director of Health. If you or anyone else chooses not to, that's your choice. It's a free country.
Well, I guess despite what my momma told me I must be from Missouri, because all I can say is this: Show me. If it's true, show me. If it exists, show me. If you have nothing to hide, show me.

If you want to take some political hack's word for everything then fine. I'm a proud skeptic - I don't just take everything said at face value, eespecially when it's said by a politician. I swear our school system must have gone to heck in a handbasket if taking a political hack's word precludes natural curiousity and overrides skepticism as well as the public's right to know if the most powerful man in the world has told the truth about his nativity story. Just show us the dadgum thing alreaady!
 
I

It's On A Slab

Guest
Maybe this will help (maybe not, but i will make the attempt):
Hawaii has a state law forbidding the release of private information, such as birth certificates(so, no, even the Governor cannot release Obama's BC without violating that law; I would guess Obama could override that.).
#hawaii.gov/health/vital-record...
"State law prohibits the DOH for disclosing any information about a Hawaii vital record unless the requestor has a direct and tangible interest in the record. This includes verification of vital records and all the information contained in a record. Vital records disclosure laws protect all birth, death, marriage and divorce records held by the department and all amendments, changes, supporting records, and requests related to vital records."
October 31, 2008
Statement from Dr. Chiyome Fukino:
"I as Director of Health for the State of Hawaii, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."
The above have satisfied McCain, Boehner, McConnell and everyone in Congress except the birthers; as much as I don't really like any of them, I'm going to believe Hawaii's Director of Health. If you or anyone else chooses not to, that's your choice. It's a free country.
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twofbyc

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Well, I guess despite what my momma told me I must be from Missouri, because all I can say is this: Show me. If it's true, show me. If it exists, show me. If you have nothing to hide, show me.

If you want to take some political hack's word for everything then fine. I'm a proud skeptic - I don't just take everything said at face value, eespecially when it's said by a politician. I swear our school system must have gone to heck in a handbasket if taking a political hack's word precludes natural curiousity and overrides skepticism as well as the public's right to know if the most powerful man in the world has told the truth about his nativity story. Just show us the dadgum thing alreaady!
Typically, a state's "Director of Health" is not a "politician"; these are usually (as in this case) "doctors"; so if you don't want to take the word of some medical hack (to go along with your anathema to believe any 'political' hack), that's fine.
But Obama's BC WAS posted online a long time ago; it's just a certain bunch of fruitcakes deemed that "fake". So no matter what gets posted, you and your ilk will deem it "fake", no matter which "political" or "medical" hack in the State of Hawaii (duly appointed and elected officials) say it's not.
I said before it's a free country; you can think and feel whatever you like. That same freedom applies to me, and my belief that "birthers" are loonies and fruitcakes, because the question has, in fact, been answered by those authorized to do so, and that explanation has satisfied the majority of people in our Government, and our country; and, quite probably, all reasonable people anywhere on the planet.
 

2003TIDE

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Knee jerk? Really? Its been two years. Just produce the original/certified birth certificate. Really, it's only just a little Constitutional requirement. It would be so much easier to shut everyone up. Even Chris Matthews has called for him to show it.
Really? It's a constitutional requirement to show every nut who says he wasn't born in th US his birth cert? i musta missed that part.
 

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