Heisman winners Bryant should have had

[Alabama22]

I've had people tell me this weekend how much better Saban is than Coach Bryant because he now has two Heisman winners at Alabama and Bryant had zero at Bama. I reminded them of a couple of things. Namath in 1964, Stabler in 1966 and Musso in 1971 should have all won the Heisman, in my opinion. But the national bias against Alabama in the mid-60's (because of George Wallace) probably had a lot to do with the results there. In 1971, Pat Sullivan won the Heisman, and Johnny Musso finished either 3rd or 4th. I don't remember. But in the Iron Bowl that year, which was played after the award was given to Sullivan, Bama and Musso beat AU 31-7.

Anyway, I'm not taking anything away from Coach Saban. He very well may be a better overall coach than Bryant. I'm just happy to have lived through both eras, and feel privileged to have seen a lot of great Alabama teams in person. We are very lucky to have Coach Saban leading our team!

 

[Al A Bama]

I've had people tell me this weekend how much better Saban is than Coach Bryant because he now has two Heisman winners at Alabama and Bryant had zero at Bama. I reminded them of a couple of things. Namath in 1964, Stabler in 1966 and Musso in 1971 should have all won the Heisman, in my opinion. But the national bias against Alabama in the mid-60's (because of George Wallace) probably had a lot to do with the results there. In 1971, Pat Sullivan won the Heisman, and Johnny Musso finished either 3rd or 4th. I don't remember. But in the Iron Bowl that year, which was played after the award was given to Sullivan, Bama and Musso beat AU 31-7.

Anyway, I'm not taking anything away from Coach Saban. He very well may be a better overall coach than Bryant. I'm just happy to have lived through both eras, and feel privileged to have seen a lot of great Alabama teams in person. We are very lucky to have Coach Saban leading our team!

I agree those three earned it and deserved it as much as anyone. Namath was much better than John Huarte (I think that was his name). He beat him out for the QB job for the N. Y. Jets. There may have been at least one Bama player that deserved the award in the 1940's. That 1966 team got SHAFTED in more ways than one!!!!!!! Why does Noter Dumb almost always get in the way because of the national media. They are the media's darlings!

Musso, 'nuff said!

 

[Alabama22]

I agree those three earned it and deserved it as much as anyone. Namath was much better than John Huarte (I think that was his name). He beat him out for the QB job for the N. Y. Jets. There may have been at least one Bama player that deserved the award in the 1940's. That 1966 team got SHAFTED in more ways than one!!!!!!! Why does Noter Dumb almost always get in the way because of the national media. They are the media's darlings!
Musso, 'nuff said!

Plus, I believe Ozzie Newsome might have gotten some consideration for the Heisman in the 70's had we thrown the ball more back then. He made some unbelievable catches during his four years at Alabama.

 

[TideMan09]

Different situations when it comes to recruiting..I was a lil guy during The Bear's run at Bama, but, seems like I read he was able to offer more schollies to lower ranked recruits, Coach Saban simply can't do in this day & age, Coach Bryant had lots more system 3, 4-5yr system players we don't have now days at Bama..The best of the best high school players are in line as we speak wanting to come play 2-3yrs for Coach Saban & then head on to the NFL..Pretty much NFL ready & instant Heisman Contenders in the right situations..

I'm not saying either HC is better than the other, different time & recruiting situations..We have more instant impact Blue Chippers now days & those Player's are the one's that puts up instant big numbers from the get-go cause they're that good..We had more system players that gets better & better each year under Coach Bryant..Plus..There was a West Coast & Ohio Valley bias in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's,80's & the 90's as well..

 

[Gr8hope]

TideMan, can you remember when 80 or 90 players dressed out on the home side? It was a different time them.

 

[crimsonaudio]

Bryant was essentially before my time (not to mention both my parents went to UT, so I was brainwashed as a child, :biggrin2, but I believe he would have found the way to compete and excel in today's environment. That said, Saban has performed at an incredible level despite the modern restrictions and the resulting competitive SEC.

A vast majority of schools never get one coach like Bryant or Saban, it's amazing we have had two...

 

[GP for Bama]

There was definitely a bias toward Midwestern and Western football through the 60's and 70's. This was obvious with the AP Poll and the Heisman.

 

[CrimsonJag]

Both great coaches. Different era's. I choose to let it go. Nothing we can do about the past, even if it's last week.

 

[BamaInBham]

Bryant was essentially before my time (not to mention both my parents went to UT, so I was brainwashed as a child, :biggrin2, but I believe he would have found the way to compete and excel in today's environment. That said, Saban has performed at an incredible level despite the modern restrictions and the resulting competitive SEC.

A vast majority of schools never get one coach like Bryant or Saban, it's amazing we have had two...

IMO, Wallace Wade is in the category of Coach Bryant and Coach Saban. He won 3 NCs in his 8 years. He started, with an assist from Xen Scott, Bama's championship legacy. First Southern team to play in the Rose Bowl - he beat a heavily favored Wash team, finishing a perfect season. Followed that up with another perfect reg season and a tie with Pop Warner's perfect Stanford team in the next year's Rose Bowl, then finished off another perfect season with a Rose Bowl shutout victory over a perfect Wash State team 4 years later - 1930, his last year. What Wade accomplished at Alabama changed college football and Alabama forever and cannot be overstated.

So IMO, Bama has had 3 transcendent coaches.

Frank Thomas, a great coach, was just a half of a notch below. He won 1 NC, I don't count 1941, and had another perfect season in 1945, topping it off with a slaughter of USC who had won all of its previous 9 Rose Bowls. Bama finished 2 in the AP behind Army who was a truly great team. 7 of his 15 teams lost 1 or fewer games. He lost 2 or fewer 12 times and never lost more than 4. He won the first 2 and 3 of the first 5 SEC championships. He won a total of 4 SECC during the 11 years he could. He was 2-1 in Rose Bowls and 4-2 in major bowls.

The 21 years from 1925-1945, from Bama's first Rose Bowl til they restricted it in 1945 to the Big 10, Bama was 4-1-1 against the PAC representative, the rest of the country was 4-11.

 

[bama579]

Namath. Agreed. Ozzie Newsome. Another agreement.

Tony Nathan. At least a nomination.

John Hannah. Has a o-lineman ever won the trophy? Hannah probably should have. Also, nomination for Dwight Stephenson.

Lee Roy Jordan. Defensive players had almost no shot even in his day. I'm still convinced he was the best player in the nation.

 

[BamaMoon]

Different situations when it comes to recruiting..I was a lil guy during The Bear's run at Bama, but, seems like I read he was able to offer more schollies to lower ranked recruits, Coach Saban simply can't do in this day & age, Coach Bryant had lots more system 3, 4-5yr system players we don't have now days at Bama..The best of the best high school players are in line as we speak wanting to come play 2-3yrs for Coach Saban & then head on to the NFL..Pretty much NFL ready & instant Heisman Contenders in the right situations..

I'm not saying either HC is better than the other, different time & recruiting situations..We have more instant impact Blue Chippers now days & those Player's are the one's that puts up instant big numbers from the get-go cause they're that good..We had more system players that gets better & better each year under Coach Bryant..Plus..There was a West Coast & Ohio Valley bias in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's,80's & the 90's as well..

TideMan, can you remember when 80 or 90 players dressed out on the home side? It was a different time them.

Bryant was essentially before my time (not to mention both my parents went to UT, so I was brainwashed as a child, :biggrin2, but I believe he would have found the way to compete and excel in today's environment. That said, Saban has performed at an incredible level despite the modern restrictions and the resulting competitive SEC.

A vast majority of schools never get one coach like Bryant or Saban, it's amazing we have had two...

IIRC, the schollie limits today can be traced back to Coach Bryant era. It is said that he'd offer a schollie to players just to keep them from going to other schools.

Also, remember there was a time when a freshman couldn't play varsity football. Also, because of the lack of info, recruiting was basically a one day event for the fan who got a little info from the evening news or newspaper the next day after signing.

Back in those days, you'd rarely hear about a player until he was a jr. or sr. - just the way CPB did things, it seemed.

One other thing, his players, especially running backs, didn't rack up the stats of other teams because of how CPB spread carries around to his many back in the triple option system.

 

[derek4tide]

Tony Nathan
Johnny Musso
Joe Namath
Ken Stabler
Pat Trammel
Lee Roy Jordan

 

[Displaced Bama Fan]

Namath. Agreed. Ozzie Newsome. Another agreement.

Tony Nathan. At least a nomination.

John Hannah. Has a o-lineman ever won the trophy? Hannah probably should have. Also, nomination for Dwight Stephenson.

Lee Roy Jordan. Defensive players had almost no shot even in his day. I'm still convinced he was the best player in the nation.

It's funny you mention Lee Roy Jordan. Just last Monday night when Dallas was playing the 'Skins, Gruden mentioned Lee Roy Jordan and how great he was.

 

[oskie]

... One other thing, his players, especially running backs, didn't rack up the stats of other teams because of how CPB spread carries around to his many back in the triple option system.

... Not sure what year/years it was, but I seem to recall Coach Bryant using his RB's to run the plays in to the huddle

 

[BamaMoon]

... Not sure what year/years it was, but I seem to recall Coach Bryant using his RB's to run the plays in to the huddle

Sounds familiar too. Such a different era.

And remember backin those days we weren't on TV every Saturday. Just a few times a year...big games like IB, UT, Penn State, etc.

Back in those days I went to far more games than I saw on TV.

 

[Bubbaloo]

Leroy Jordon was my idol as a kid!! High praise from CPB

During his career for Alabama, Jordan received high praise from Bryant, who stated, "He was one of the finest football players the world has ever seen. If runners stayed between the sidelines, he tackled them. He never had a bad day, he was 100 percent every day in practice and in the games."[SUP][3][/SUP]

 

[TideEngineer08]

Don Hutson's senior year was the year prior to the start of the Heisman trophy. He most assuredly would have won it.

Harry Gilmer was a finalist twice and should have taken home the trophy at least once.

As for Coach Bryant's players, you all have already listed them. Namath, Stabler, Musso. They all could have won it if the circumstances were different. I do believe there was a bias against the South an in particular, Alabama, in those days. However, had Alabama had an offensive system that produced greater individual results during the 1970s, I do believe Coach Bryant would have had a Heisman winner during that time. Tony Nathan, or even one of the QBs like Todd or Rutledge would have had a good chance, but the wishbone spread out the stats.

I don't think that makes him less of a coach than Coach Saban, though. To me, he still towers over the game and I was born after he passed away. Coach Saban is getting awful close to that stature though.

 

[B1GTide]

I am too young to remember much of the Bryant era at Alabama, but my favorite player to ever come out of Alabama is John Hannah. I know that he is an offensive lineman, and I have only seen video of him in college, but I grew up watching him destroy defensive linemen in the NFL. You simply cannot play the game better than he did.

 

[bamaslammer]

Not a Bryant player but I put Derrick Thomas in the top five football players who ever lived. Unfortunately Barry Sanders was almost a no-brainer pick that year. But will anyone ever have 27 sacks in a season again? I seriously doubt it.

 

[Crimson1967]

It's funny you mention Lee Roy Jordan. Just last Monday night when Dallas was playing the 'Skins, Gruden mentioned Lee Roy Jordan and how great he was.

Gruden is just trying to kiss up so he can get the job when Saban leaves.


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