You know, there is no such thing constructive criticism when those guys are giving their all, and we are behind a computer, myself included.
Is Shula the offenses' problem?
- Thread starter HammerJammer
- Start date
64 -
That is so funny - I love it! Some of these people were talking about wanting Mike to get a raise 2 days ago - now they're going to say "HE'S" the problem. OMIGOSH---- Like he or anyone else LIKES to lose or doesn't want to win. PAH-LEEEZ. He & all the rest of the team needs ENCOURAGEMENT right now to get ready for NEXT week - MOVE ON - Look toward the next hurdle...........
That is so funny - I love it! Some of these people were talking about wanting Mike to get a raise 2 days ago - now they're going to say "HE'S" the problem. OMIGOSH---- Like he or anyone else LIKES to lose or doesn't want to win. PAH-LEEEZ. He & all the rest of the team needs ENCOURAGEMENT right now to get ready for NEXT week - MOVE ON - Look toward the next hurdle...........
Dangerous question. It was this kind of question that had me banned from my other sn. I would say that Shula nor Radar is to blame for our inconsistent offensive play. A lot of people have forgotten that we have an extremely young oline. They came out this season with explosion but eventually injury and inexperience caught up with them. I hope that Darby decides to stay for his senior year because this oline is going to be unstoppable next year. Plus we need consistent hands for our wr's! If we could have caught half of the drops today we would have won. This season is far from over and we can still top the cake of this amazing year with a nice bowl game.
The problem is Alabama has no offensive tradition to fall back on. Naturally, when you have no previous tradition how can there be an expectation of excellence?
Alabama has won a lot of games in the past, therefor we expect them to win games. Simple enough.
Alabama has played really good defense in the past, and naturally your average Alabama fan expects a stifling, well-tackling defense.
Unfortunately, Alabama does not have any offensive tradition look at to set any kind of standard for what we want to accomplish as of now.
Under Gene Stallings the offense sucked. Under Mike Dubose the offense sucked. Under Franchione the offense had some very impressive games, but never averaged more than 28 in either of his two years.
And now, under Shula, the offense...yes...sucks. Call it what you want...the offensive lines troubles, injuries the previous couple seasons, dropped passes by the WRs this year...fact is...something has to give eventually.
It seems every time something has gone wrong with the offense the past three seasons it has been everything BUT the coaches faults. CMS has done a nice job as Bama's head coach this season, but the fact is, our offense is not getting the same coaching job our defense is.
Mike Shula is calling the plays for Alabama, correct? Well, if that is the case, he is not doing a good job. The offense has been just as effective the previous three seasons as his offense was when he was the coordinator at Tampa Bay. It hasn't.
In 03 the reason for our offense's struggles was that there was a new system being implemented and the coaching staff only had a little over a month to work with the players.
In 04 the reason for our offense's struggles was the injury to Brodie and the injuries later in the year to Darby.
In 05 the reason for our offensive struggles is the injury to Prothro and a young, banged up offensive line.
In 06 the reason for our offensive struggles will be a young soph. QB going against the tough SEC D's.
In 07 the reason for our offensive struggles will be a new group of skill players that will have trouble catching the ball...
The point is, at some point our coaching staff is going to have to persevere. It's coaching. I think a lot of people realize this fact, yet are for some reason afraid to admit it, except when talking about it with friends or something.
Does anyone believe this offense will ever be one of the top 2-3 in the SEC as long as Mike Shula is calling the plays?
Why not hire someone with a proven track-record to call the plays...ala Al Borges at Auburn??
CMS will be the head coach at Alabama for many years to come, but as long as he is calling the shots offensively Alabama will not turn the corner and be an SEC title caliber or National champ. caliber team. That's just my opinion, and it makes a lot of sense to me. Flame if you want...but the fact is...Mike Shula has a terrible track record calling plays, and nothing in the past three seasons has led anyone to believe that the offense will be any different.
Alabama has won a lot of games in the past, therefor we expect them to win games. Simple enough.
Alabama has played really good defense in the past, and naturally your average Alabama fan expects a stifling, well-tackling defense.
Unfortunately, Alabama does not have any offensive tradition look at to set any kind of standard for what we want to accomplish as of now.
Under Gene Stallings the offense sucked. Under Mike Dubose the offense sucked. Under Franchione the offense had some very impressive games, but never averaged more than 28 in either of his two years.
And now, under Shula, the offense...yes...sucks. Call it what you want...the offensive lines troubles, injuries the previous couple seasons, dropped passes by the WRs this year...fact is...something has to give eventually.
It seems every time something has gone wrong with the offense the past three seasons it has been everything BUT the coaches faults. CMS has done a nice job as Bama's head coach this season, but the fact is, our offense is not getting the same coaching job our defense is.
Mike Shula is calling the plays for Alabama, correct? Well, if that is the case, he is not doing a good job. The offense has been just as effective the previous three seasons as his offense was when he was the coordinator at Tampa Bay. It hasn't.
In 03 the reason for our offense's struggles was that there was a new system being implemented and the coaching staff only had a little over a month to work with the players.
In 04 the reason for our offense's struggles was the injury to Brodie and the injuries later in the year to Darby.
In 05 the reason for our offensive struggles is the injury to Prothro and a young, banged up offensive line.
In 06 the reason for our offensive struggles will be a young soph. QB going against the tough SEC D's.
In 07 the reason for our offensive struggles will be a new group of skill players that will have trouble catching the ball...
The point is, at some point our coaching staff is going to have to persevere. It's coaching. I think a lot of people realize this fact, yet are for some reason afraid to admit it, except when talking about it with friends or something.
Does anyone believe this offense will ever be one of the top 2-3 in the SEC as long as Mike Shula is calling the plays?
Why not hire someone with a proven track-record to call the plays...ala Al Borges at Auburn??
CMS will be the head coach at Alabama for many years to come, but as long as he is calling the shots offensively Alabama will not turn the corner and be an SEC title caliber or National champ. caliber team. That's just my opinion, and it makes a lot of sense to me. Flame if you want...but the fact is...Mike Shula has a terrible track record calling plays, and nothing in the past three seasons has led anyone to believe that the offense will be any different.
No, I am not crazy. What I said is what I think, and it is logical.
In four years as offensive coordinator at Tampa Bay his offenses ranked 28th, 29th, 22nd, and 28th out of 30 teams in the NFL at the time.
It's hard to look at these stats and THEN look at what Bama has done offensively the past three seasons and not notice a trend.
And, again...I am not crazy.
In four years as offensive coordinator at Tampa Bay his offenses ranked 28th, 29th, 22nd, and 28th out of 30 teams in the NFL at the time.
It's hard to look at these stats and THEN look at what Bama has done offensively the past three seasons and not notice a trend.
And, again...I am not crazy.
So your basically blaming Shula, but trying to justify it by being critical of past Alabama teams which is unjustifiable. Because we have had excellent OC in the past, but it seems to make your criticism less critical on CMS. There is absolutely no way that you can criticize Homer Smith's career as an OC.SaintDeuce said:
What would you do different? What is your plan for Alabama's Offense? Have you sent your Resume to Mal Moore?
Hey, there's no reason to be so offensive in your response...I'm just trying to converse about a topic of interest on this board.ldlane said:
What I was saying about past Alabama teams is that Alabama has NO offensive tradition to fall back on. Even under Homer Smith Alabama NEVER averaged more than 30 pts a game!
I do not have a plan for Alabama's offense, but what I am suggesting is actually taking a look at some coordinators with impressive resume's. I am looking at our current offense and I see an offense with predictable playcalling and total lack of inovation at any point in any game over the past three seasons.
This is consistent with Mike Shula's previous offenses. If the man has never led a top notch offense what does that mean? That he has had tough luck and has coached terribly untalented teams? Maybe, but for every season of his coaching career?
I don't have all the answers to our offensive problems, and I don't think anyone does. But what I am suggesting is hiring a PROVEN offensive coordinator instead of the Shula/Rader comb. which has proven ineffective thus far. We aren't talking about HUGE COACHING STAFF CHANGES...come on. Shula has done an outstanding job leading the team. I just don't think his playcalling and overall management of the offense is up to par with the better coordinators around the country.
CMS is still very young. What innovations are you looking for in our offense? We are 9-1 afterall. Homer Smith was a "proven" OC, but you don't seem to feel that he was any good at all.
I want to hear some answers from all of the critics!
I think you have NO proof that we don't have an offensive postion. We were rolling over opponents in the 70's with the wishbone and keep the ball for 5 minute drives. You might say that we don't have a "passing" tradition, but then you will be taking away from the accomplishments of Namath, Stabler, and Hunter. Give me some numbers!
I want to hear some answers from all of the critics!
I think you have NO proof that we don't have an offensive postion. We were rolling over opponents in the 70's with the wishbone and keep the ball for 5 minute drives. You might say that we don't have a "passing" tradition, but then you will be taking away from the accomplishments of Namath, Stabler, and Hunter. Give me some numbers!
Last edited:
Well, will any of the "innovations" I might respond with have any credibility on this board? Nope, and whatever ideas for the offense some random fans has will immediately be shot down by whoever is critical of BEING critical of the offense.ldlane said:
What I would SUGGEST doing for some fans looking for answers and how an offense should be run and managed throughout a game is to watch an Auburn offensive game called under Al Borges. They are the best example in the SEC, as they hired a guy with previous credibility running a successful offense after struggling the previous year and currently have the best offense in the SEC.
Yes. We are 9-1. But I believe, and I think a lot of other fans believe, that we have the best defense in the SEC, and possibly in the country. And with an offense as good as Auburn's or some other top notch offense, we would have a legit. shot at the national championship.
Alabama has a defense that is better than USC's and just as good as Texas.
Offense is what separates us from the elite teams in college football.
I would like some numbers historically to prove that we don't have an "offensive" tradition. Maybe, we haven't had the "offensive" philosophy that you approve of, but we have had to have offense to win as many games as we have as well as championships.
Auburn always needs more fans!
Auburn always needs more fans!
ldlane said:
That was kind of like hiring Jeff Gordon to drive your lawn mower. Whats the point?
ldlane said:
Well, AU is irrelevant...they're just a good ex. of the offense I was talking about.
As for Alabama's offensive tradition...or lackthereof...Alabama has averaged MORE than 30 pts. just twice since 1980.
And Alabama has averaged FEWER than 25 pts. per game in 2004, 2003, 1999, 1998, 1997, 1996, 1995, 1994, 1990, 1987, etc etc etc...
Alabama has won in SPITE of the offense with EXCELLENT defense over the years. That is why we have won championships.
When you average fewer than 25 pts. for so many seasons it sets a standard of mediocrity offensively for the program, and so eventually fans set a 'good' offensive season as 26-27 pts. per game.
Whereas a program like, let's say Florida State considers this season, a season in which they are averaging 30+ and are #1 in the ACC in passing yards per game, a pathetic season offensively.
Florida State was just some random example, but if any of the teams that have had ACTUAL offensive success as WELL as elite defensive success over the previous decade and a half or so, average BELOW 25 pts. per game it is considered a total failure.
Well, at Alabama 25 pts. per game is considered the norm.
There is NOT a tradition of success offensively at Alabama. It has always been grind it out, and until someone tries to aggressively improve the offense...ala Auburn in 04...ala Notre Dame in 05...the offense will remain in 1986.
Well, then in my opinion you need to take a closer look. Now, don't get nerdy like me and break down the offenses..lol...but their play-calling is, for the most part, unpredictable.ldlane said:
Yes, they have a very good offensive line. However, UGA is still getting pressure on Cox. He is maintaining his composure and accurately delivering passes. If you'll watch, almost every pass that they throw is a HIGH PERCENTAGE PASS, in stark contrast to our offense, in which most of the passes are highly difficulty 15 yard outs or just fly-patters that require a perfectly placed pass.
But, your arguement is on "offensive philosophy" and having the personnel to carry out your philosophy. If you have the personnel "Grinding it out" can produce points. It is OK to avg. 25 pts. a game as long as your defense doesn't give up 26 pts. a game.
That being said, being a graduate of FSU and a person that has had the pleasure of sitting down and talking to Coach Bowden about football and the "philosophy" of coaching I would say that he would probably tell you the same. Coaching is more than having you team averaging over 30 pts. per game and our tradition goes back further than 1980.
That being said, being a graduate of FSU and a person that has had the pleasure of sitting down and talking to Coach Bowden about football and the "philosophy" of coaching I would say that he would probably tell you the same. Coaching is more than having you team averaging over 30 pts. per game and our tradition goes back further than 1980.
Well, then it just boils down to preference. As a fan, I would PREFER Alabama be a team that can be expected to put up around 31 points a game on a yearly basis, as teams such as Miami, Florida State, Florida, Michigan, USC, etc etc etc have.ldlane said:
I set the '1980' mark because I consider that to be the closest thing to the 'modern' era of football. I realize that our offense goes back further than 1980. lol, obviously we've had a little bit of success prior to 1980.
But offensively that is where the game has changed sooooo drastically.
Defense still wins you games, but you are not going to beat USC or Texas by scoring 17 pts. Therefor you do need an offense that will score 27-31 pts. Correct?
And as for "scoring 25 pts. a game as long as the defense doesn't give up 26 pts. a game"...Alabama is currently averaging 24 pts. a game and giving up 9 pts. a game. Shouldn't they be undefeated then? Well, they played a team with a 'slightly' better offense and a D that was just as good. Therefor they lost.
If Alabama would've had a better offense they would've had a better shot to win the game today, correct?
And, oddly enough I'm a CURRENT student at Florida State...Haha...haven't gotten the chance to talk to Bobby Bowden just yet unfortunately.
Amazon Prime Day Deals for TideFans!
Hangtime University of Alabama - Alabama Crimson Tide Bama Nation - University of Alabama Route Sign
Get this and many more items during Amazon Prime Day Deals (July 8-11)!
Get a Prime Free Trial!
