I'm also from Mobile and I have played against A.J. in high school as well as had a few conversations with him and yes his is as cocky as they come.This isn't always a bad thing but if gets in his head that there is no reason to get better or to help my teammates get better that is when it becomes a problem. As far as the QB race I also think people are under estimating AJ's experience. Looking past the game experience you have to think about all the extra reps he has gotten being the second team quarterback in practice. Not the ideal kind of experience we would like but experience nonetheless. As far as PS goes I haven't seen anything other than high school film on him and I will not judge a player on high school film when refering to a division 1 quarterback battle. I think this race could honestly come down to the last couple weeks before the season opener before a choice is made.
Let's get it started: A.J. McCarron vs. Phillip Sims
- Thread starter bonehouse81
- Start date
Close one but it seems like Sims was better in highschool than McCarron but that doesn't mean who's better now.
I just want the better QB to start
I just want the better QB to start
Completely agree rolltidewin! I just want the best QB to play.
Just for the sake of conversation, Sims broke major high school QB records in Virginia and is from a very competitive area. The VA Beach/Norfolk area is a hotbed for athletic talent and their sports programs are very competitive. I believe he has a very high ceiling. ROLL TIDE
Based on what's happened to date, I believe AJ is #1 slot right now. He has received more practice snaps and more live snaps. He should know the offense better. I haven't seen any comments regarding film study on either AJ or Sims. I also haven't seen comments about either's workout (either gym or 7v7) commitment. Both would be interesting if anyone knows. Both would also demonstrate a work ethic to the rest of the team.
JMHO - But unless there is some clear separation during spring, I think AJ starts next year, but Sims gets to play a good bit ... either due to AJ getting his bell rung as we break in a new LT or AJ doing something against Coach Saban's wishes and getting his ego checked. Fortunately, I think the defense will be in beast mode next year, and other teams scoring will be a major challenge. We could have games where the defense out scores our offense.
JMHO - But unless there is some clear separation during spring, I think AJ starts next year, but Sims gets to play a good bit ... either due to AJ getting his bell rung as we break in a new LT or AJ doing something against Coach Saban's wishes and getting his ego checked. Fortunately, I think the defense will be in beast mode next year, and other teams scoring will be a major challenge. We could have games where the defense out scores our offense.
I want to express my appreciation to those who've helped raise this discussion out of second-hand anecdotes concerning behavior of the two kids. Both these kids are cocky and each thinks he should be the future QB of UA. As has been mentioned above, that's really not all that undesirable in a QB. A QB without an ego is unlikely to succeed. We can only hope that the guy who comes in second can accept the backup role. If not, that's the breaks. I think more QBs transfer in search of more PT than any other position...
Just to be clear, I don't think anyone says that AJ's experience is worthless. I just think people say that if Phillip looks better, he'll get the nod. AJ's experience isn't enough to truly give him a notable advantage.
Again, one year ago, Star had more game experience, and a lot more practice snaps than AJ (having been on campus for a full year more than AJ). But, there was no question one year ago, that AJ was the #2 QB. Had McElroy gone down, AJ would have been the undisputed starter. That is because AJ was the better QB, despite not having the experience nor the practice reps.
The gap between AJ and Phillip is not likely as wide as the gap between Star and AJ last year, but the idea is the same to me. Experience and reps are only a part of the equation. Ultimately, it will come down to leadership and ability. If Phillip has the edge in those two areas, but AJ has experience and reps, the experience and reps he has will not overcome a leadership and ability advantage for Sims.
I've said it before in this thread, but I just want to be clear that I am not even saying Sims will be the starter. I just think it is a very very open competition, with both really starting at the same point.
That certainly seems to be the case. It makes sense, only one can play at a time and it seems harder to have any kind of rotation like you can with RBs. That being said, I'd hate to see Sims transfer; I believe he has a huge upside and would like to see him as our starting QB at some point (if not this year then in the future).
My impression has always been that CNS tends to favor experience. I think because he's a defensive minded coach he has a conservative philosophy on offense, which means not turning the ball over. That tends to favor experience but not always. So AJ might have a slight edge due to experience (and I agree that experience, even mop up duty and extra practice time matter), but if he makes mistakes, takes too many chances, etc. he could lose out to Sims. As far as us having a McCoy/Bradford type QB, McCarron and/or Sims may be of that mold, we may have had one in the past, but under CNS we might not know it. With CNS' conservative offensive philosophy there's no way we have a QB throwing the ball around like those guys did. I just don't see CNS exposing his defense like that.
Can't believe you'd even mention this! And to say this is the reason you think PS will start???
BB, if everyone would just read what you said with an open mind this matter would be settled (as much as it could be at this point in time).
CNS's tendency (especially with qbs) is to go with the guy who has the most time in the system. Again, at this point in time, the nod would have to go with AJM.
Of course, all of this "might" change after spring ball so really this debate is probably more about who goes into spring practice as the #1.
One other point I'd like to remind everyone about. For the most part, GMAC is respected as a qb who led us to #13. But the one knock on him by the fans in the two years he started was about his hesitancy in the pocket that led to sacks. IF AJM is the "gunslinger" some have said he is, my question is "Isn't this what many people want?" Those who complained about GMAC taking sacks will probably love AJM's style. Granted, a gunslinger mentality might lead to a few INTs, but it'll also lead to alot more explosive plays and points. Seems like I remember CNS saying that's what our offense needed last year.
At this point we don't know and spring practice might answer some questions. But I'll agree with those who say the edge goes to AJ at this point.
You're clearly not familar with how an armchair quarterback is supposed to evaluate real quarterbacks: They're considered great until they actually play, at which point they become much worse than the guy who hasn't actually played :wink:
I bet that many of the people who wanted to shoo off McElroy will miss him at times next season.
If Saban gives the nod to the quarterback least likely to turn the ball over, I don't think that gives AJ much of an edge. Of course Sims could have the same aggressive mentality, I haven't seen him play enough. But experience is one thing. Learning from experience is another. Experience doesn't necessarily equate to less turnovers; if anything it cements your play style, and AJ's thus far has been aggressive, so I don't think experience playing aggressively will equate to less turnovers. If AJ's "experience" is of taking big risks and going to for it all, that just means he'll be more likely to play that way in the future. It doesn't mean he's gonna throw less interceptions.
I can almost see where AJ's experience could hurt him. He's got to play mop up duty it games that were already in hand (aside from Auburn). That means he was in a very low-risk, high-reward scenario. If he used to playing like that, it could hurt in real SEC play. He was able to take big risks without worrying about screwing up, because the game was already won. I can't imagine his experience in games was much more of challenge than practice.
Someone with less time in the system could come across as much more "experienced" if he's a good learner. In the end it will come down to who is the better learner. Sims said he came to Alabama to win national championships and play for Saban, and he only came in a semester after AJ knowing he wanted the job after GMac. It wouldn't surprise me if his time in McElwain's offense has been more significant, or "dense" from a learning and competitive standpoint.
I can almost see where AJ's experience could hurt him. He's got to play mop up duty it games that were already in hand (aside from Auburn). That means he was in a very low-risk, high-reward scenario. If he used to playing like that, it could hurt in real SEC play. He was able to take big risks without worrying about screwing up, because the game was already won. I can't imagine his experience in games was much more of challenge than practice.
Someone with less time in the system could come across as much more "experienced" if he's a good learner. In the end it will come down to who is the better learner. Sims said he came to Alabama to win national championships and play for Saban, and he only came in a semester after AJ knowing he wanted the job after GMac. It wouldn't surprise me if his time in McElwain's offense has been more significant, or "dense" from a learning and competitive standpoint.
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I don't think CNS "prefers" a conservative qb. I think he runs the offense to the level of the player's ability. There was no doubt the offense opened up more when GMAC took over for JPW. I would assume that if either PS or AJM were of the Manning caliber then the offense would function accordingly and "conservative" would be the last word we'd use when describing CNS's approach.
I guess it depends on how you define "conservative" offensive philosophy. Someone mentioned Colt McCoy and Sam Bradford. I'm sorry I don't see a CNS coached team throwing the ball 30 to 40 times per game, even if he had Peyton Manning at QB. It just doesn't fit with his overall philosophy of controlling the clock and wearing down the opposing defense. Sure CNS wants to be able to effectively pass the ball, wants to take shots downfield to keep the defense honest and have explosive plays. I just don't expect an Alabama QB to EVER put up McCoy/Bradford or possibly even Mallet numbers.
I think Saban will do whatever he has to do to win the game. He strives for balance. You see UTexas without a good RB for years because the best RB's don't want to play where there is no balance. Malcolm Brown went there only because Mack promised him they were changing the offense.
For the record, I think McArron will take the starting position. I think Sims has a better long ball, but McArron will prove he understands the reads and defenses better. I think understanding will be the determining factor. Being behind McElroy for 2 years and learning is huge. I would imagine Sims was stuck with the Practice squad for most of the year. I imagine that even if McArron starts the first game, the competition will not be over. If Sims gets his chance, he could end up the starting QB by year end. Either way, we are in good hands.
I see McArron compared to Brodie. Not just body build, but quick release and feisty. Tough-minded and resillient. He definitely has something to prove with some of the fans.
I see Sims like Andrew Zow. Slow deliberate release, but very accurate. Always looks calm and collected in the pocket. Always looking downfield. Never gives up on a play or a game. Both are great leaders and could be All-Americans.
For the record, I think McArron will take the starting position. I think Sims has a better long ball, but McArron will prove he understands the reads and defenses better. I think understanding will be the determining factor. Being behind McElroy for 2 years and learning is huge. I would imagine Sims was stuck with the Practice squad for most of the year. I imagine that even if McArron starts the first game, the competition will not be over. If Sims gets his chance, he could end up the starting QB by year end. Either way, we are in good hands.
I see McArron compared to Brodie. Not just body build, but quick release and feisty. Tough-minded and resillient. He definitely has something to prove with some of the fans.
I see Sims like Andrew Zow. Slow deliberate release, but very accurate. Always looks calm and collected in the pocket. Always looking downfield. Never gives up on a play or a game. Both are great leaders and could be All-Americans.
They may be the best duo we've had in a true "open" QB competition. In most cases separation is very obvious from the get-go. They're not going to tell us that but,,,,, We have been very fortunate with QB injuries for way too long.
Here is a free rivals link talking about him coming out of highs school.
AMP: Rivals100 Sims perfect fit at Bama - Rivals.com Video
AMP: Rivals100 Sims perfect fit at Bama - Rivals.com Video
I mentioned Bradford, but didn't mean that we should or would throw the ball that often. I agree with you that we probably won't see that in a CNS offense no matter who the QB is. What I actually want is a signal caller that is Bradford-like in that their skill set is dynamic enough to punish other defenses, even when it is third and long and everyone is expecting a pass.
I'll have to disagree here. When you get a superior athlete at the QB position you don't turn around and hand the ball off 30 times a game and don't allow him to throw the ball unless you've got a Jim Brown/Barry Sanders/Bo Jackson type back in the backfield. I think Coach Saban runs the offense according to the strengths of the offense and the players within it.
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