ADMIN NOTE: LSU Fans - see my final post: Re: Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong...

[Fishhead]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

I really am surprised at the clueless statements here. No offense, but not a single person that's posted in this thread has posted factual info, save one.

I've read about how the vertabrae didn't break themselves. Here's a clue. The guy with broken vertabrae is not the same guy that implicated JJ in this. JJ has nothing to do with that guy's injuries. JJ is charged ONLY with Andrew Lowery's injuries...which do NOT include broken vertabrae.

I've read about the victim's DNA being on JJ's shoes. It isn't. This is info that has already been released and documented. Why just post crap like that as if it's fact?? When in fact, it's factually wrong, and has been PROVEN wrong with DNA testing??

This thing is no longer about LSU's QB. It's about Jordan Jefferson and Josh Johns, as well as Andrew Lowery. As an LSU fan, I couldn't possibly care less about Jordan Jefferson's future playing status at LSU. Why should you guys? Do you guys believe a person should just be presumed guilty of what some drunk teenager says he did without due process?? Wow...

SINCE this fight occurred, Andrew Lowery has been PROVEN to lie to police in a SEPERATE incident he 'found himself in' a couple weeks ago. His lie to police was in FACT to place responsibility for an injury he suffered on an innocent civilian, when in FACT the responsibility was solely his own. At least that lie was caught quickly, confirmed as a lie, and squashed. What a credible accuser this guy is...the "Marine".

PT Barnum was right.

 

[red55]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

In regards to the alleged victim I also love how LSU fans like to paint the picture the guy deserved to be kicked in the face for prior behavior to help defend JJ and the players.

Not one person has said that. Not one. What has been said is that his criminal record is long and his credibility is low. Jefferson and Johns have never been in trouble with the law.

Any clown that has to kick someone like that when they on the ground is a coward plain and simple. Defending it is just as bad.

I haven't defended anybody. I have suggested that allegations are not convictions. You haven't even heard Jeffersons side of the story, but the Grand Jury will.

The Marine might be an alleged vistim but JJ still is an alleged criminal.

Exactly. Alleged. Innocent until proven guilty in the United States of America.

 

[Fishhead]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

What do you mean by 'forcing his truck'? I heard he blew his horn for people to get out of his way so that he could leave, and the players took offense to being blown at, and that's when the fight started. Is this anywhere close to the truth?

That's what we ALL heard the day after the fight. Of course, after the police realized they needed to quit trying the case in the media by blabbing every little 'witness' statement in front of a camera, other statements from other witnesses came out refuting that. Bar employees (ya know, the sober ones) refuted that statement, and in fact said Lowery started not one, but TWO fights before he was told to leave the bar. Those same sober people told authorities that JJ was not fighting. They stated the truck came into the crowd aggressively, not politely blowing their horn. The fight was ongoing when the truck entered the crowd.

 

[red55]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

That's not what "inconclusive" means . It means the available sample was insufficient for producing a reliable result . Which is another way of saying something IS there , but that what it is could be debated . It's the same as having a breathalizer test which can show on the result card that alcohol is present even though the sample was insufficient and would not be entered into evidence by the prosecution . It's still there though .

Not really. It means that no DNA could be found that includes or excludes an individual.

Three types of results can occur in DNA testing: inclusion, exclusion, and inconclusive. It is important that victim service providers understand the meaning of these terms and be able to explain their implications.

Inclusion. When the DNA profile of a victim or suspect is consistent with the DNA profile from the crime scene evidence, the individual is “included” as the possible source of that evidence.

Exclusion. When the DNA profile from a victim or suspect is inconsistent with the DNA profile generated from the crime scene evidence, the individual is “excluded” as the donor of the evidence.

Inconclusive. Inconclusive results indicate that DNA testing could neither include nor exclude an individual as the source of biological evidence.

 

[Fishhead]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

Here's another thing. I don't know of a SINGLE LSU fan that thinks that...IF JJ kicked this guy in the head, or did ANYTHING illegal, he should be set free. NOBODY thinks that.

The point is, it is only right to determine guilt or innocence the right way. You can't just decide a person is guilty based on what the victim's friends told the police. And yes, the people that made the initial statements and accusations against Jefferson were all Lowery's friends, even though initially they claimed to not know him...and vice versa.

None of this sounds "shady" to you guys?? The victim and his friends have been caught in multiple lies from the beginning, but all of that is overlooked, and the verdict is in from some people based on initial statements, many of which have been proven to be lies...lies the victim and his buddies told.

 

[OreBama]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

No opinion on the actual investigation. However, I will state that it is pretty bad when a team's supporters are forced to play amateur lawyer. Carry on...

 

[Fishhead]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

http://theadvocate.com/home/828084-79/jefferson-gets-33-pairs-of.html

Lowery, who was taken to a local hospital by his family and treated for moderate injuries, initially told troopers he was hit when Whitman changed lanes, the report says.
Lowery, 21, later changed his story and told troopers he was hit after he stuck his arm into Whitman’s lane of travel in an effort to “catch a ride,” the report says.

 

[mikes12]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

So far, Coach Miles is handling this the right way, as far as I can tell. If it turns out that those 18 players are lying to cover for their teammate, Les will have a big problem on his hands. Please note I said "If". I don't mean to imply guilt or innocence either way, because I don't know.

 

[LCN]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

Not really. It means that no DNA could be found that includes or excludes an individual.

Which , as I stated , clearly does not mean that "NO" , your word choice , DNA was there .

 

[LCN]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

No opinion on the actual investigation. However, I will state that it is pretty bad when a team's supporters are forced to play amateur lawyer. Carry on...

At least there's one about 15' from me . And she is amused

 

[Fishhead]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

No opinion on the actual investigation. However, I will state that it is pretty bad when a team's supporters are forced to play amateur lawyer. Carry on...

I agree. Of course, nobody is forcing us to. It's just difficult to sit here and read things that have been proven incorrect, with correct information readily available to anyone with a computer/newspaper/radio/TV and a desire for truth. Instead, it's clear plenty have no desire for the truth. Why enter facts into the discussion when it's a lot more fun to spread BS??

We're all fans of college football. Football is a game. This however is not about college football. If Jordan Jefferson is cleared tomorrow, he will not be playing QB at LSU anytime soon. He hasn't been involved in practices, meetings, nothing, in a month.

He graduates from college in December, with a degree from LSU. I don't care if he plays another down of football at this point. If this was all about football, I think it's fair to say most LSU fans would rather Lee or Mettenberger as LSU QB. However, I think if he is found to be innocent of what he is charged of, then it's a sad thing that his career was cut short for nothing.

 

[CenLA Tiger]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

Uhhh, I've been here nine years, rookie. I'm not lost.

Oh, I see, wasn't trying to offend you. Needless to say I am a "rookie" (on this particular message board). I was not talking down to you in any way and apologize if some how you were offended by my statement. Now, by rookie, I assume you mean on this site. If the nine year thing is some type of badge of honor for you, I will concede your nine years to my 2 months. I made no mention that you were lost.

I was actually implying that I didn't think that you would get very many understanding post. Obviously, you were trying to be rude to me. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

 

[Tide Warrior]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

Here's another thing. I don't know of a SINGLE LSU fan that thinks that...IF JJ kicked this guy in the head, or did ANYTHING illegal, he should be set free. NOBODY thinks that.

The point is, it is only right to determine guilt or innocence the right way. You can't just decide a person is guilty based on what the victim's friends told the police. And yes, the people that made the initial statements and accusations against Jefferson were all Lowery's friends, even though initially they claimed to not know him...and vice versa.

None of this sounds "shady" to you guys?? The victim and his friends have been caught in multiple lies from the beginning, but all of that is overlooked, and the verdict is in from some people based on initial statements, many of which have been proven to be lies...lies the victim and his buddies told.

And you can not just assume that football players and friends of Jefferson are telling the truth either. Just like the employees of the bar who seem to generate the majority of their revenue from LSU students, football players, and fans. Both seem shady to me.

My point though why I have seen so many that say JJ is not guilty they quickly assasinate the character of Lowery. Maybe Lowery is lieing but what gives any LSU fan the right to determine that. LSU fights for justice for a LSU football fan but yet because they believe he is unjustly accused quickly do the same against Lowery. A little shady there I think.

 

[Fishhead]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

Oh, I see, wasn't trying to offend you. Needless to say I am a "rookie" (on this particular message board). I was not talking down to you in any way and apologize if some how you were offended by my statement. Now, by rookie, I assume you mean on this site. If the nine year thing is some type of badge of honor for you, I will concede your nine years to my 2 months. I made no mention that you were lost.

I was actually implying that I didn't think that you would get very many understanding post. Obviously, you were trying to be rude to me. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

I just wish one of you would've told us how many posts you have here.

 

[Fishhead]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

And you can not just assume that football players and friends of Jefferson are telling the truth either. Just like the employees of the bar who seem to generate the majority of their revenue from LSU students, football players, and fans. Both seem shady to me.

My point though why I have seen so many that say JJ is not guilty they quickly assasinate the character of Lowery. Maybe Lowery is lieing but what gives any LSU fan the right to determine that. LSU fights for justice for a LSU football fan but yet because they believe he is unjustly accused quickly do the same against Lowery. A little shady there I think.

Man, this is on a tee.

Anyway, you're correct that I cannot assume JJ is innocent. Now, show me where I did...good luck.

And to the assination of Lowery's character, it wasn't an assasination...it was (and continues to be) a suicide of his own character. There is no "maybe Lowery is 'lieing' (also known as lying, but whatever). Lowery has in fact lied, been caught in lies, and eventually admitted to lies. There's no assumption about that. I as an LSU fan didn't determine that. The facts are right out there in the open...for those that wish to see them. But instead, like I said, it's much more fun to slander a presumed innocent until proven guilty young man...because after all, he plays for our opposition.
THAT'S what's 'shady'.

Believe this, Lowery's character...just like in ANY 'trial'...WILL be a focal point. It IS relevant. Don't worry though...JJ's character will be a focal point too.

And to be honest, my entire reason for speaking up at all here is because absolute lies/untruths for you politically correct among us...were being typed as fact. Now that a little fact enters the conversation, it isn't as much fun, I guess. Sorry to let facts get in the way.

 

[Tide Warrior]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

Man, this is on a tee.

Anyway, you're correct that I cannot assume JJ is innocent. Now, show me where I did...good luck.

And to the assination of Lowery's character, it wasn't an assasination...it was (and continues to be) a suicide of his own character. There is no "maybe Lowery is 'lieing' (also known as lying, but whatever). Lowery has in fact lied, been caught in lies, and eventually admitted to lies. There's no assumption about that. I as an LSU fan didn't determine that. The facts are right out there in the open...for those that wish to see them. But instead, like I said, it's much more fun to slander a presumed innocent until proven guilty young man...because after all, he plays for our opposition.
THAT'S what's 'shady'.

Believe this, Lowery's character...just like in ANY 'trial'...WILL be a focal point. It IS relevant. Don't worry though...JJ's character will be a focal point too.

And to be honest, my entire reason for speaking up at all here is because absolute lies/untruths for you politically correct among us...were being typed as fact. Now that a little fact enters the conversation, it isn't as much fun, I guess. Sorry to let facts get in the way.

Just because someone did something before does not mean they always will. Maybe for Lowery it is like crying wolf that eventually no one will believe him when he does tell the truth. But you say it is a fact he lied in this situation can you please show me where this took place. I am sorry but I have not really followed this and actually forgot about it until this thread was started. Maybe he did lie this time and I missed it but since you seem to know all the facts I would like to read it. Again just asking.

Now if Jefferson was not there this would not even be an issue but he was and I guess that is alright since so many seem to have no issue with it. Not saying you but many on the LSU boards. Just like many seem to overlook no matter what actually happened and who started what or who was involved that some serious injuries did happen and everyone seems to forget that part and only focus on how innocent Jefferson is.

Regarding being a rival fan I could care less because no matter who LSU has at QB I truly believe it will not make a difference when LSU comes to town. RTR

 

[Chukker Veteran]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

I'm presuming these same 18 gave their version to Miles, and yet, JJ is suspended anyway. I find that very interesting...

Thankyou for that. Sometimes the obvious gets glossed over by the spin.

 

[westide]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

I guess it must be quiet over at Tiger Rant since everyone is over here!

 

[TIDE-HSV]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

LSU FANS LISTEN TO ME - SHUT UP!! You are way past abusing your status as guests. See what you agreed to concerning "ignorant sparring." Bama players got crucified for pages-long threads on your forum (and most of you are from one site), with our minor legal scrapes, and even the textbook issue. When I tried to point out the presumption of innocence, I was shouted down, sometimes with words not even allowed on this forum. I finally quit posting on your forum altogether. One sorrow Rich took to his grave was his deep disappointment in you guys, your moderation and your refusal to defend reasonable discussion. He saw it as a betrayal of friendships. The playing field has not been held level. You've made your point - now give it a rest. If you continue, I will ban each and every one of you, one by one, if you violate what I've laid down in this post. If you want to discuss this, then PM me. DO NOT CONTINUE TO SPAR IN THIS THREAD, IF YOU VALUE YOUR MEMBERSHIP ON THIS FORUM. If this seems emotional, why, yes, it is..

 

[CoastGhost]

Re: 18 LSU Players Sign Witness Testimonies Saying Jefferson Did Nothing Wrong

Who let all the east Texans in here? :tongue: