Mike, Mike, Mike, & Kalen?

[bamaga]

Don't miss the point. Nick's strategy was get the best players. We did that for his entire tenure. When he realized we could not do that anymore, he retired. We do not have the best players now, especially in the trenches on the O and D lines. Coaching is a problem now yes, but Alabama will not be the same as under Saban because we cannot corner the market on talent like we once could.

I get that’s the popular opinion, but his last 2 classes were two of the 3 best in the history of college football according to 247 composite . With the other being the Texas aTm class. He signed Julian Sayin and Caleb Downs. Recruiting wasn’t an issue . Don’t buy into that narrow minded thinking.

 

[CoolBreeze]

I get that’s the popular opinion, but his last 2 classes were two of the 3 best in the history of college football according to 247 composite . With the other being the Texas aTm class. He signed Julian Sayin and Caleb Downs. Recruiting wasn’t an issue . Don’t buy into that narrow minded thinking.

Yea, but Julian and Caleb came to the University to play for the GOAT, not the money. Once Nick hung it up because of this money, money, money situation, both those dudes bolted.

 

[bamaga]

Yea, but Julian and Caleb came to the University to play for the GOAT, not the money. Once Nick hung it up because of this money, money, money situation, both those dudes bolted.

i was strictly talking about Nick’s ability to recruit. No, I don’t think Coach DeBoer will have that level of success recruiting. Especially if the wheels come off this season.

 

[bamaga]

At least Price's pathic performance was only witnessed by one.

Mike had a good time from all accounts.

 

[CoolBreeze]

i was strictly talking about Nick’s ability to recruit. No, I don’t think Coach DeBoer will have that level of success recruiting. Especially if the wheels come off this season.

I dig. FWIW, I do think there is hope that DeBoer will learn from this and adapt. That was Nick's signature move. Dude has won a lot of games to this point which points to the fact that he has the meddle to make the right changes. Whether he does or not will determine his fate and the rest of this season.

 

[RammerJammer14]

Mike had a good time from all accounts.

All accounts both figuratively and literally

 

[NativeTider]

It's been a long time since I've posted on here. Probably because we were on cruise control with Saban for so long there was nothing controversial to discuss.

I've been around Bama football for decades. I experienced the highs of Coach Bryant, Stallings and Saban and the lows of the others. In my lifetime there are only 3 coaches who had the personality and skillset to coach Bama- Bryant, Stallings and Saban. DeBoer is NOT cut from the same mold. This job is eating him alive in real time. No way he makes it. The next coach needs to be cut from the same cloth as the three I mentioned or our new walk in the wilderness may take a while.

 

[BamaFanInTally]

In addition to a new DC, we need to go get Bo Davis back as D-Line coach. He could flat out coach the D-Line.

 

[10Bama54]

In regards to Saban winning all the first games. They played every game at a neutral site or at home. They didn’t have to play at their opponents home field and have that war chant going on constantly. And top that off we had a first year QB. Now I don’t know what was wrong in the first half with the defense. Could be they were missing Keenan plugging up the middle.

In the games that were lost last year:
Vandy-we lost by 5 points and Jalen threw a pick 6.
Tn-we lost by 7 points and Jalen had 2 picks that stopped drives.
Oklahoma-we lost by 21 points and Jalen had 3 picks that led to points.
MI-we lost by 6 points and Jalen had 1 INT

 

[dabamafan]

I’m going to bring up three things regarding Deboer’s personality. First, the fact that it was pretty obvious it would be a notable contrast between him and Saban. Second, the fact we were the only school not to have a transfer out since Spring. Third, our proactive assumption that in the new NIL/portal era, you were going to have to have someone to balance egos in this new “players era” and be a little softer at the right times to keep team chemistry.

Based on the evidence at hand, Deboer is being successful as what we assumed college ball was going to need in the new landscape. However, it’s not going to take long to prove that assumption wrong if hard traditional coaching isn’t still the game prep/gameday rule of the land. Maybe that kind of duality is hard to pull off genuinely.

Whether this team can come home and find its true mettle, should that exist, will quickly determine if we simply have “the guy after The Guy” or something more.

Either way, he was stacked up with an arsenal of tools that none of the previous Mikes had, particularly Shula - and Price unofficially doesn’t count.

THIS !!!

 

[dabamafan]

With the utmost respect to you, I’d suggest that you don’t have a keen enough memory of the Shula and Dubose eras. I cut my Bama football teeth during their tenures and remember them vividly.

DeBoer may yet prove to be a complete bust, but let’s consider the following:

Shula and Dubose both posted losing seasons (4-9 and 4-7 respectively) in their first year after inheriting teams that had each won 10 games the previous year. I said this last year - the fact that DeBoer didn’t immediately run us into the ditch was an achievement in and of itself. A low bar to clear, but still pertinent. Sark and Cristobal were 5-7 in their first seasons at UT and Miami, and Sark had a similarly loaded roster.

Dubose changed his offensive philosophy probably 7-8 times during his tenure, with several changes coming mid-season. He could never put together a cogent vision of what style of team we wanted to be. DeBoer at least knows that.

Shula had no prior HC experience and at his highest previous post, OC in Tampa Bay, he was an abject failure. Completely unqualified and it showed over time. Didn’t have the schematic uncertainty of Dubose or the level of off-field scandal, but we handed the keys to a sports car to a kid with a permit. DeBoer at least has a very solid track record.

As far as I’m concerned, DeBoer is still leaps and bounds better that those two. Those really were the dark ages and we haven’t sniffed that yet. We may prove to under DeBoer; given his track record and recruiting prowess I think it’s unlikely. He may not be a championship level coach and if that’s the case we will have to make a business decision at some point, but it’s way too reactionary to treat him as though we hired someone completely unqualified with no track record like the previous Mikes.

Dubose is still the worst we’ve had in my lifetime. Shula was bad, but not for the same reasons. I still think DeBoer looked like the best available candidate at the time we made the hire, assuming you couldn’t get Sark or Kirby (which we couldn’t). He may still not pan out, but we definitely didn’t hire an unqualified noob like those two previous coaches.

Completely agree. It is uncomfortable at the moment and and I am nervous.

With the utmost respect to you, I’d suggest that you don’t have a keen enough memory of the Shula and Dubose eras. I cut my Bama football teeth during their tenures and remember them vividly.

DeBoer may yet prove to be a complete bust, but let’s consider the following:

Shula and Dubose both posted losing seasons (4-9 and 4-7 respectively) in their first year after inheriting teams that had each won 10 games the previous year. I said this last year - the fact that DeBoer didn’t immediately run us into the ditch was an achievement in and of itself. A low bar to clear, but still pertinent. Sark and Cristobal were 5-7 in their first seasons at UT and Miami, and Sark had a similarly loaded roster.

Dubose changed his offensive philosophy probably 7-8 times during his tenure, with several changes coming mid-season. He could never put together a cogent vision of what style of team we wanted to be. DeBoer at least knows that.

Shula had no prior HC experience and at his highest previous post, OC in Tampa Bay, he was an abject failure. Completely unqualified and it showed over time. Didn’t have the schematic uncertainty of Dubose or the level of off-field scandal, but we handed the keys to a sports car to a kid with a permit. DeBoer at least has a very solid track record.

As far as I’m concerned, DeBoer is still leaps and bounds better that those two. Those really were the dark ages and we haven’t sniffed that yet. We may prove to under DeBoer; given his track record and recruiting prowess I think it’s unlikely. He may not be a championship level coach and if that’s the case we will have to make a business decision at some point, but it’s way too reactionary to treat him as though we hired someone completely unqualified with no track record like the previous Mikes.

Dubose is still the worst we’ve had in my lifetime. Shula was bad, but not for the same reasons. I still think DeBoer looked like the best available candidate at the time we made the hire, assuming you couldn’t get Sark or Kirby (which we couldn’t). He may still not pan out, but we definitely didn’t hire an unqualified noob like those two previous coaches.

Agreed ! It is uncomfortable right now and I am nervous !

 

[bamamc1]

My brother and his family came up yesterday to celebrate mom’s birthday. My niece dates a West Alabama football player. Subsequently, my brother had the opportunity to talk to several WA coaches after the game. Scarborough, Ragland, Square and each of them talked about how soft we are, practices being moved to 7 AM to avoid the heat, and the fact that our staff is usually out of there each afternoon. Those guys played at Bama and know what it takes to win and the sacrifices that have to be made.

I think a lot of the issues we’ve encountered the past few years started when Scott Cochran left for UGA. The toughness is nowhere near what it used to be. The disciplined play is nowhere near what it used to be. I doubt a LANK coup would have happened because he would have recognized it and snuffed it out. It would have been all about team and not a handful of players hijacking an entire program.

If nothing else, at least we’re not hearing that Lank crap this year.

 

[selmaborntidefan]

With the utmost respect to you, I’d suggest that you don’t have a keen enough memory of the Shula and Dubose eras. I cut my Bama football teeth during their tenures and remember them vividly.

DeBoer may yet prove to be a complete bust, but let’s consider the following:

Shula and Dubose both posted losing seasons (4-9 and 4-7 respectively) in their first year after inheriting teams that had each won 10 games the previous year. I said this last year - the fact that DeBoer didn’t immediately run us into the ditch was an achievement in and of itself. A low bar to clear, but still pertinent. Sark and Cristobal were 5-7 in their first seasons at UT and Miami, and Sark had a similarly loaded roster.

Dubose changed his offensive philosophy probably 7-8 times during his tenure, with several changes coming mid-season. He could never put together a cogent vision of what style of team we wanted to be. DeBoer at least knows that.

Shula had no prior HC experience and at his highest previous post, OC in Tampa Bay, he was an abject failure. Completely unqualified and it showed over time. Didn’t have the schematic uncertainty of Dubose or the level of off-field scandal, but we handed the keys to a sports car to a kid with a permit. DeBoer at least has a very solid track record.

As far as I’m concerned, DeBoer is still leaps and bounds better that those two. Those really were the dark ages and we haven’t sniffed that yet. We may prove to under DeBoer; given his track record and recruiting prowess I think it’s unlikely. He may not be a championship level coach and if that’s the case we will have to make a business decision at some point, but it’s way too reactionary to treat him as though we hired someone completely unqualified with no track record like the previous Mikes.

Dubose is still the worst we’ve had in my lifetime. Shula was bad, but not for the same reasons. I still think DeBoer looked like the best available candidate at the time we made the hire, assuming you couldn’t get Sark or Kirby (which we couldn’t). He may still not pan out, but we definitely didn’t hire an unqualified noob like those two previous coaches.

There are two other issues here regarding DeBoer's hiring here, too, that once the emotion of "he needs to go" dies down have to be considered:

1) Who else was available to take the job when Saban retired?

Seriously, who else out there THAT WE ACTUALLY HAD A CHANCE TO GET was going to come to Alabama, a guy who didn't need OJT, a guy who did have something of a proven track record of winning.

This was not us hiring Bill Curry over Bobby Bowden by any stretch.

Ryan Day was not coming to Alabama (and was considered on a hot seat last November).
Sark was not coming to Alabama, either.
Kirby Smart was not coming to Alabama.

My understanding - which may be incorrect - is Oregon's Dan Lanning wasn't coming, either.

That MAYBE leaves us Dabo, Lame Kitten, and maybe Norvell, the same Norvell who followed up an unbeaten season with a 60-point blowout loss in a bowl game and a 2-10 season. Dabo and Kitten come with various sorts of baggage.

History may well show DeBoer was out of his league coming here, but that doesn't mean we get to revise it and say, "We could have hired X but we got stuck on DeBoer," either.

2) Who is the upgrade replacement?

Let's not act like the Panic Posse over in Lee County, either, who were so trembling in their boots of "Arkansas is gonna beat us with Gus" that they forked over $49 million apparently just laying around in the streets.

It's like a war - it's EASY to start down the path, it's tough to finish.

 

[CajunCrimson]

There are two other issues here regarding DeBoer's hiring here, too, that once the emotion of "he needs to go" dies down have to be considered:

1) Who else was available to take the job when Saban retired?

Seriously, who else out there THAT WE ACTUALLY HAD A CHANCE TO GET was going to come to Alabama, a guy who didn't need OJT, a guy who did have something of a proven track record of winning.

This was not us hiring Bill Curry over Bobby Bowden by any stretch.

Ryan Day was not coming to Alabama (and was considered on a hot seat last November).
Sark was not coming to Alabama, either.
Kirby Smart was not coming to Alabama.

My understanding - which may be incorrect - is Oregon's Dan Lanning wasn't coming, either.

That MAYBE leaves us Dabo, Lame Kitten, and maybe Norvell, the same Norvell who followed up an unbeaten season with a 60-point blowout loss in a bowl game and a 2-10 season. Dabo and Kitten come with various sorts of baggage.

History may well show DeBoer was out of his league coming here, but that doesn't mean we get to revise it and say, "We could have hired X but we got stuck on DeBoer," either.

2) Who is the upgrade replacement?

Let's not act like the Panic Posse over in Lee County, either, who were so trembling in their boots of "Arkansas is gonna beat us with Gus" that they forked over $49 million apparently just laying around in the streets.

It's like a war - it's EASY to start down the path, it's tough to finish.

Everything you typed is true.
Everything else typed by others has been too. l

 

[December05]

There are two other issues here regarding DeBoer's hiring here, too, that once the emotion of "he needs to go" dies down have to be considered:

1) Who else was available to take the job when Saban retired?

Seriously, who else out there THAT WE ACTUALLY HAD A CHANCE TO GET was going to come to Alabama, a guy who didn't need OJT, a guy who did have something of a proven track record of winning.

This was not us hiring Bill Curry over Bobby Bowden by any stretch.

Ryan Day was not coming to Alabama (and was considered on a hot seat last November).
Sark was not coming to Alabama, either.
Kirby Smart was not coming to Alabama.

My understanding - which may be incorrect - is Oregon's Dan Lanning wasn't coming, either.

That MAYBE leaves us Dabo, Lame Kitten, and maybe Norvell, the same Norvell who followed up an unbeaten season with a 60-point blowout loss in a bowl game and a 2-10 season. Dabo and Kitten come with various sorts of baggage.

History may well show DeBoer was out of his league coming here, but that doesn't mean we get to revise it and say, "We could have hired X but we got stuck on DeBoer," either.

2) Who is the upgrade replacement?

Let's not act like the Panic Posse over in Lee County, either, who were so trembling in their boots of "Arkansas is gonna beat us with Gus" that they forked over $49 million apparently just laying around in the streets.

It's like a war - it's EASY to start down the path, it's tough to finish.

Norvell would’ve been as bad or worse as what we’ve seen so far. To be clear, he got the postgame interview, as well as a sticker and an ice cream cup after the game, but Gus was leading that team Saturday - obviously. Players came off the field looking to him during the game and he was the one out front pacing the sideline. That’s why in strong likelihood he’ll be leading the Razorbacks, or quite possibly the Lee County Tigers, next year and we’ll inevitably face him either at FSU, when Arkansas comes back on the schedule 20 years shy of their last win over us or ready to send Auburn fans into convulsions facing us.

No matter if justified or not, the college football world sees us as being owed tons of karma, and we better have leadership with a warrior mentality to confront that.

 

[arthurdawg]

If Gus would just listen to an expert in the passing game... His offense could be one of the best ever.

But he has not done so in the past.

 

[LittleLexi]

That's six games out of 14 that Alabama hasn't been prepared to play.

Why should I believe Kalen isn't another Mike for Alabama?

Seriously, please convince me...

I know Ty went to the Manning passing camp, did CKD go to the Mike Shula Coaching camp?

 

[bama579]

I accidentally called him Kalen DuBose Freudianly

Word of the day in a post notable for on-target brevity.
Kudos