Bama Game Thread: Official Postgame Thread - Bama vs. Michigan...

[Slowpoke Catracho]

When all is said and done, IF this season was really as much of a duct tape and band-aid situation as some believe, then hats off to the coaching staff for putting together a season where we were a hair away from playing for a national title.

I think there are many that say we were "lucky". I'm not one that believes in luck. To me luck is what happens when "Preparation meets Opportunity". It goes both ways during competition.

 

[BamaMoon]

I think crimsonaudio was correct when he said Saban didn't want to throw anyone under the bus. If Saban would have said it was supposed to be a pass to Williams then it leads to a rather embarrassing question for Milroe which is " Why didn't you even look towards Williams when you picked the ball up?"

Then something worse happened. Jalen Milroe sat right beside CNS and they both looked into the eyes of the press and told outright lies. Jalen even "bragged" that he appreciated the coaches trusting him on the last play to put the ball into his hands.

If Jalen is so fragile that he can't admit he messed up (if that's what happened) or that Coach can't say the play that we were supposed to run was a pass but the snap was bad and threw off the timing then we know the real issue with this team is not physical, but mental. Mentally/emotionally weak.

I just see no reason to create a false narrative under these conditions. Either way the play failed. There's no honor lost in failing. Just take ownership. Simple as that.

 

[92tide]

calling coach saban and milroe liars is pretty lame

 

[Toddrn]

Then something worse happened. Jalen Milroe sat right beside CNS and they both looked into the eyes of the press and told outright lies. Jalen even "bragged" that he appreciated the coaches trusting him on the last play to put the ball into his hands.

If Jalen is so fragile that he can't admit he messed up (if that's what happened) or that Coach can't say the play that we were supposed to run was a pass but the snap was bad and threw off the timing then we know the real issue with this team is not physical, but mental. Mentally/emotionally weak.

I just see no reason to create a false narrative under these conditions. Either way the play failed. There's no honor lost in failing. Just take ownership. Simple as that.

Like I said in another thread. There is no accountability anymore.

 

[BamaMoon]

calling coach saban and milroe liars is pretty lame

I don't think they did. I think they told the truth about what happened. It was a run play 100%.

I'm not the one who said they created a false narrative.

 

[graydogg85]

We don’t know that would be the case. Imagine if we had a qb that could audible out of bad plays and see the whole field to hit open receivers. Would the Auburn game even been close? Would we have struggled against Arkansas?

On the other side of that coin: does Ty Simpson run for 155 yards and 4 TDs against LSU? Does he kill Ole Miss, Texas A&M, and Tennessee over the top with multiple precise deep throws to Bond and Burton? If our defense lays a bit of an egg against Auburn like they did, does Ty make that read and that throw to the corner of the end zone to Bond? Does he play with incredible poise against UGA and help us generate an unlikely win throwing and running? He might, we don't know for sure but Jalen won the job for a reason.

I see the point you are making, we went with a guy who was more limited in terms of being able to run the entire playbook and make reads, changes at the LOS, etc.. That said, Milroe accounted for 3,365 yards and 36 touchdowns this season (and that includes missing an entire game). A number of folks will have him near the top of the Heisman list next season (he barely missed getting an invite to NYC this year).

I can't get behind the notion that the staff made the wrong call. He might not be able to audible at the LOS, and he might have to look to the sideline, etc.. but that doesn't necessarily make him any less effective. It might mean that he won't be a great NFL QB, but there are literally tons of guys who were super effective in college and weren't great pro QBs. Our objective is for him to be an elite college QB. Not sure if the guy has the skill set to be effective in the NFL but honestly that doesn't matter for our purposes - and I know the next question some may have have is "doesn't that hinder recruiting?" As in, you aren't developing NFL caliber QBs. I would usually say the answer to that is "yes" but the caveat for us is that Milroe is an outlier - it's not like we run Malzahn's offense and we can point to Bryce, Tua, Mac, etc. who all ran variants of the same offense and have been NFL starters. I think we ride Milroe as long as he's our best chance to win and be very productive on offense - and heck, if he improves as much next year as he did over the course of 2023 he may very well end up in the thick of the Heisman race.

 

[BamaMoon]

I don't want my comments about the last play of OT and CNS's and JM's comments to be misconstrued.

Coach can protect players; he can use "coach speak" to say one thing while something else might still be true, etc.

All I was suggesting is I believe what CNS and JM said about the last play is an accurate account of what happened. I believe them.

The confusion is why would Kobe Prentice offer a different narrative? KP was in the slot so he should have known the play call. But if the call was a swing pass to Roydell, why have the pulling right guard to the left? I guess it's possible that the particular play could be a "RPO" in the sense that QB might be able to choose which play to run (QB keep OR swing pass) but since we've been told Jalen didn't have those QB reads/decision placed on him, I'm just gonna stick to believing CNS and JM knew more about what was supposed to happen in that instance than KP.

But again, I freely admit the swing pass SHOULD have been the call and probably would have been a walk in TD for Roydell.

 

[crimsonaudio]

I don't want my comments about the last play of OT and CNS's and JM's comments to be misconstrued.

Coach can protect players; he can use "coach speak" to say one thing while something else might still be true, etc.

All I was suggesting is I believe what CNS and JM said about the last play is an accurate account of what happened. I believe them.

The confusion is why would Kobe Prentice offer a different narrative? KP was in the slot so he should have known the play call. But if the call was a swing pass to Roydell, why have the pulling right guard to the left? I guess it's possible that the particular play could be a "RPO" in the sense that QB might be able to choose which play to run (QB keep OR swing pass) but since we've been told Jalen didn't have those QB reads/decision placed on him, I'm just gonna stick to believing CNS and JM knew more about what was supposed to happen in that instance than KP.

But again, I freely admit the swing pass SHOULD have been the call and probably would have been a walk in TD for Roydell.

Agreed - I'm not calling anyone a liar, but it's interesting that we have a player (who would know) suggest otherwise and even the RB looked exasperated when looking back for the ball.

There are reasons to question what was said - if nothing else there was potentially confusion as to what the actual call was.

 

[Bama_N_Va]

So you were willing to live with a possible 3 or 4 loss season to have another QB running the offense? I'm not sure many Bama fans would be willing to do that.

Given what BoB did to the O, maybe trying to get the best options on the field for the future would not have been a bad way to go, and I would have supported it.

 

[RollTide_HTTR]

Look, we didn't play a great game and we probably win that game if one of like 10 plays goes differently. That doesn't mean we shouldn't make changes for next season but I think given the situation we were in we did pretty well and made most of the right decisions as far as personnel. This was a good season that was close to being a great one. I do not think we wasted the season in any way.

 

[PA Tide Fan]

Then something worse happened. Jalen Milroe sat right beside CNS and they both looked into the eyes of the press and told outright lies. Jalen even "bragged" that he appreciated the coaches trusting him on the last play to put the ball into his hands.

If Jalen is so fragile that he can't admit he messed up (if that's what happened) or that Coach can't say the play that we were supposed to run was a pass but the snap was bad and threw off the timing then we know the real issue with this team is not physical, but mental. Mentally/emotionally weak.

I just see no reason to create a false narrative under these conditions. Either way the play failed. There's no honor lost in failing. Just take ownership. Simple as that.

I guess it's possible that it was indeed supposed to be a Milroe run and perhaps Prentice was wrong. Occasionally players get confused about what a play should be, especially if they aren't the one getting the ball., but either way it appeared the play should have gone left, run or pass. Jalen definitely panicked after the bad snap though because I'm pretty sure the play was not designed to go straight ahead right into a brick wall.

 

[Cruloc]

That makes it even more astonishing that we went with Milroe instead of Simpson. I get it, he was the easiest and quickest path to winning, or it seemed that way in September. I didn’t think it was the correct decision then and still feel this way although I swallowed my tongue and supported the team.

Not only did we go with Milroe, but we continued trying to run an offense that requires a QB to read and make pre-snap adjustments. It wasn't until we simplified things for Milroe that we started having much success.

However, simplifying things then makes it easier to stop.

Its just frustrating all around really. Simpson not settling in during the spring and fall camp, Milroe being a strikeout or a homerun being the best option at QB.....the team picking their chosen one....all pre-snap duties going to Seth.

We wasted a year of QB development.

 

[BamaMoon]

Posted by @Cruloc in another thread:

This is a great (and funny) analysis of the final play. He admits both the run and swing pass were both there for the taking, but he strongly points out that Jalen panicked and didn't follow his pulling right guard. If he does he very likely scores and we go to double OT!

 

[Cruloc]

posting the same critiques over and over seems to go well beyond diagnosis.

and us getting better is not really a function fans diagnosing weaknesses. that is saban, the staff and the team’s job

ROBOT VOICE:
Milroe is the best.
Saban is the GOAT.
Fans have no right to say anything remotely bad.
Everyone will improve in 2024.

 

[BamaMoon]

I guess it's possible that it was indeed supposed to be a Milroe run and perhaps Prentice was wrong. Occasionally players get confused about what a play should be, especially if they aren't the one getting the ball., but either way it appeared the play should have gone left, run or pass. Jalen definitely panicked after the bad snap though because I'm pretty sure the play was not designed to go straight ahead right into a brick wall.

Correct, whether there was confusion at the time of the play or just reimagining what could have been there's definitely confusion/frustration afterward for them and us.

I think we can all agree on that 100%

 

[Cruloc]

Correct, whether there was confusion at the time of the play or just reimagining what could have been there's definitely confusion/frustration afterward for them and us.

I think we can all agree on that 100%

Seems to be that ultimately, there was confusion on what the play actually was. Prentice says pass, Roydell looks like he's just there to clear the LB, but who knows.....but Jalen didn't follow his blockers, he ran into Dippre turning his man inside and not behind the pulling guard.

PULLING GUARD alone tells me it was a designed run play, snap caused Jalen to panic, instead of following the pulling guard he ran into the Dippre turning block.

 

[BamaMoon]

Seems to be that ultimately, there was confusion on what the play actually was. Prentice says pass, Roydell looks like he's just there to clear the LB, but who knows.....but Jalen didn't follow his blockers, he ran into Dippre turning his man inside and not behind the pulling guard.

PULLING GUARD alone tells me it was a designed run play, snap caused Jalen to panic, instead of following the pulling guard he ran into the Dippre turning block.

Pulling guard = run all the way...my take too!

 

[Slowpoke Catracho]

Seems to be that ultimately, there was confusion on what the play actually was. Prentice says pass, Roydell looks like he's just there to clear the LB, but who knows.....but Jalen didn't follow his blockers, he ran into Dippre turning his man inside and not behind the pulling guard.

PULLING GUARD alone tells me it was a designed run play, snap caused Jalen to panic, instead of following the pulling guard he ran into the Dippre turning block.

Then again maybe "everyone" was confused on what play was actually called?

 

[BamaInCummingGA]

On the other side of that coin: does Ty Simpson run for 155 yards and 4 TDs against LSU? Does he kill Ole Miss, Texas A&M, and Tennessee over the top with multiple precise deep throws to Bond and Burton? If our defense lays a bit of an egg against Auburn like they did, does Ty make that read and that throw to the corner of the end zone to Bond? Does he play with incredible poise against UGA and help us generate an unlikely win throwing and running? He might, we don't know for sure but Jalen won the job for a reason.

I see the point you are making, we went with a guy who was more limited in terms of being able to run the entire playbook and make reads, changes at the LOS, etc.. That said, Milroe accounted for 3,365 yards and 36 touchdowns this season (and that includes missing an entire game). A number of folks will have him near the top of the Heisman list next season (he barely missed getting an invite to NYC this year).

I can't get behind the notion that the staff made the wrong call. He might not be able to audible at the LOS, and he might have to look to the sideline, etc.. but that doesn't necessarily make him any less effective. It might mean that he won't be a great NFL QB, but there are literally tons of guys who were super effective in college and weren't great pro QBs. Our objective is for him to be an elite college QB. Not sure if the guy has the skill set to be effective in the NFL but honestly that doesn't matter for our purposes - and I know the next question some may have have is "doesn't that hinder recruiting?" As in, you aren't developing NFL caliber QBs. I would usually say the answer to that is "yes" but the caveat for us is that Milroe is an outlier - it's not like we run Malzahn's offense and we can point to Bryce, Tua, Mac, etc. who all ran variants of the same offense and have been NFL starters. I think we ride Milroe as long as he's our best chance to win and be very productive on offense - and heck, if he improves as much next year as he did over the course of 2023 he may very well end up in the thick of the Heisman race.

The problem with your question in regards to would Ty do this or would Ty do that is that it doesn't seem anyone wanted to give Ty a chance to show what he could do.
Go back to the USF game and watch some of the passes Ty completed to lead the team to 2 TDs and ask yourself could Milroe have made those plays under the pressure Ty was under.

Again, we'll never be able to answer that.

I sincerely hope we have a true QB competition this spring/fall and a qb isn't chosen for any other reasons than his ability to win for the team.

 

[Coach D]

On the other side of that coin: does Ty Simpson run for 155 yards and 4 TDs against LSU? Does he kill Ole Miss, Texas A&M, and Tennessee over the top with multiple precise deep throws to Bond and Burton? If our defense lays a bit of an egg against Auburn like they did, does Ty make that read and that throw to the corner of the end zone to Bond? Does he play with incredible poise against UGA and help us generate an unlikely win throwing and running? He might, we don't know for sure but Jalen won the job for a reason.

I see the point you are making, we went with a guy who was more limited in terms of being able to run the entire playbook and make reads, changes at the LOS, etc.. That said, Milroe accounted for 3,365 yards and 36 touchdowns this season (and that includes missing an entire game). A number of folks will have him near the top of the Heisman list next season (he barely missed getting an invite to NYC this year).

I can't get behind the notion that the staff made the wrong call. He might not be able to audible at the LOS, and he might have to look to the sideline, etc.. but that doesn't necessarily make him any less effective. It might mean that he won't be a great NFL QB, but there are literally tons of guys who were super effective in college and weren't great pro QBs. Our objective is for him to be an elite college QB. Not sure if the guy has the skill set to be effective in the NFL but honestly that doesn't matter for our purposes - and I know the next question some may have have is "doesn't that hinder recruiting?" As in, you aren't developing NFL caliber QBs. I would usually say the answer to that is "yes" but the caveat for us is that Milroe is an outlier - it's not like we run Malzahn's offense and we can point to Bryce, Tua, Mac, etc. who all ran variants of the same offense and have been NFL starters. I think we ride Milroe as long as he's our best chance to win and be very productive on offense - and heck, if he improves as much next year as he did over the course of 2023 he may very well end up in the thick of the Heisman race.

I mean Simpson did have the longest run of the year right? It’s impossible to speculate. I don’t know how Simpson would have done and no one does. I do know I saw him make passes look easy that Milroe struggled with all year. I think people just want a fair open QB competition. If Milroe improves and can actually throw a guy open and stuff then watch out he could be almost unstoppable. That’s to me is almost as big an if as if Simpson could run the offense more efficiently.