The Republican War on Public Schools (vouchers, religion, graft, testing, etc.)
- Thread starter Huckleberry
- Start date
Correct, so why clog up classrooms and waste resources on the ones who clearly aren’t going anywhere? Trying to force the apathetic to learn is kinda like trying to legislate morality. It’s pointless.
Is it cheaper to pay for their welfare or for their jail time than to educate them?
Perhaps because there ARE people there who want to learn? People who are deperately trying to find a way out of a cycle of poverty?
Are you against mandatory education?
In many cases here in Memphis our tax dollars do both. Well, there is an attempt to educate, but certain segments of society eschew education.
The public dole is overburdened and the jails are overcrowded. Whatever we're trying to do clearly isn't working.
Uh, you lost me bro. The ones who are desperately trying to find a way out of the cycle of poverty and trash culture are not the ones I was referring to.
I understand who you were referring to. But those students are in the same schools as the students who don't give a damn.
So, do we continue trying to bring solid education to those who want it, with the possible bonus of some things sticking with those who don't care, or just cut funding for everything?
Problem is that our education system runs more like a daycare with the goal to keep kids off the streets rather than educate them
I didn’t suggest cutting funding. If anything, getting rid of the DoE could free up some funds since we won’t have to pay for pointless administration.
Not in my experience, but I’d be interested in some more details on this. Do you really think that most teachers are babysitters rather than educators?
I don't believe there are kids who truly do not want to learn. I think most kids who we think don't want to learn look around at their environment, throw their hands up, and say, "What's the use?!". I also believe kids are a product of their environment, and those who come from an environment who do not value education will think education isn't for them. But the reality is, education would bring value to that kid's life. IMO, these kids need to be reached, and I'd rather "waste" billions trying to reach them in hopes we save some than the billions it costs to house them after they're incarcerated and their life permanently altered.
First, I believe we are trying to fit too many square pegs into round holes for students really need a more kinetic classroom, hands on learning, shop/trade centered education. Now, there is a downside, like Germany, where once you've stepped out of the all classroom version of education, you're mostly stuck in the vocational education system. No design will ever be perfect or for every type of learner, but we do need to broaden our education system for kids who just can't sit in a classroom for lecture/paper work style learning.
Also, it's been very well documented through studies that our inner city, over policed, highly stressful, food insecure design harms the educational outcomes of many kids. I could spend days writing about how non-white groups have been marginalized a how this has lead us to now, but I simply don't have the time. So many of the working fixes for these issues are being cut right now such as free and reduced lunches (kids don't learn while hungry), head start, etc.
Additionally, well directed federal funds are key to bridging the gaps between rich states and poor states, just as state education funding should be used to level education funding per student between Gordo and Homestead. Asking Mississippi to self fund education at a level compared to Massachussetts is folly. The GOP just can't accept the need to invest in education at a national level, and they have been against it since Carter started the Dept. of Education, regardless of the needs or successes. Our education system is continually undermined by those who should/could be working to improve it. The last honest top-down attempt to improve education I've seen from the GOP was No Child Left Behind, but of course that had a lot off problems.
No the answer is to just shut down the Dept. of Education, and cut off money from many of the programs inside it. This take my ball and go home approach will just create a more unequal education system/outcomes and leave us with higher crime rates in the end.
Depends on the school. Some schools will not discipline students and basically force teachers to pass students who haven't done the work. At that point, yeah, the teachers are more babysitters.
Even in a school that does requires students to behave and earn passing grades, it is not an easy job.
*Yeah, it's well known that not every kid is cut out for college and needs to go a different direction wrt to career planning and preparation. The hard part is properly identifying these kids and ensuring the right ones go in the right direction and not putting them in the wrong programs too early in their developmental stages of life.
**My wife has been a school teacher for right at 30 years, and one of the hardest things for a teacher to overcome is getting through to a child who doesn't have at least one involved parent. Just like in sports, "players matter", it is even more important in a child's life, "Parents matter". They play an enormous role in the future of the child. We can provide all the external resources we want, but if a child doesn't have an involved parent or guardian walking beside them through their childhood, it is next to impossible to get a breakthrough. My wife has lived it and witnessed it her entire educational career. I'm all for improving kids environment, and I think we need to do so whenever we can. But the ultimate key to their success is having someone (at home) engaged in their lives to help direct and guide them. Without that, they are like a rudderless ship at sea.
***One of the biggest problems and wastes with the DOE is the top-heavy, non-classroom employees at the middle to top of the organization chain. We are overstaffed with exuberant salaries and benefits on top of corporate waste within that class, all the while nickel and diming our teachers to death when it comes to good pay. The teachers are the ones who deserve the upper-end pay, not the ones who sit in an office at the central offices with barely enough actual work to keep them busy for week's worth of work. There needs to be a "cleansing" in that area, and a redistribution of monies needs to go to the teachers so it will attract the best teachers possible, rather than these corporate entities getting those employees.
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