Tide Pride members beware re: digital ticket sales

[81usaf92]

For most of those who are complaining about price increases, the solution is simply for you to put your money where your mouth is:

Cancel your membership.



If these prices really are unfair, as you seem to want everyone to believe, then the University will have trouble filling your seats and will invite you back at a discounted/adjusted rate that will be much more fair to you, the customer.

If, on the other hand, there are more than enough people waiting in line to take your seats without blinking at the costs - then the price changes are, indeed, quite fair...

Yeah and this is the common argument for every hard core TP supporter.

Yet we keep seeing Bryne’s plans taking sizable detours after no one ponies up, we see discounted tickets, and we see them begging current TP members to buy extra seats.

The truth is that every game being televised and the evolution in entertainment technologies has totally killed sports attendance. It’s to the point that 75% to 80% capacity is about the closest you are ever going to get to full capacity. So what tends to happen is that when the older crowd either gets peeved because stadium renovations move them, just tired of doing it, or just can’t anymore they start to finally get new people. Those new people are far less dependable on average because they 1) haven’t been paying the donations and 2) really haven’t factored in how much going to games costs.

Unless you are just committed to certain seats then there are really no huge advantages to TP because all of the massive benefits are for those higher in points. I kinda see TP becoming more like a baseball season ticket club down the line because of the lack of commitment from newer members.

 

[ROCKEE]

A couple of things.

First, I’ve re-read my post several times and can’t find where I criticized anyone.

I did point out logical non sequiturs. Have we reached the point that such actions are personally disrespectful?

Second, recent overall economic inflation vs. the increases in costs to operate an elite collegiate athletic department, are two entirely separate things.

For example, just a couple of years ago, the notion of a DC and OC making $2-3 million a year would have been outlandish. In addition to which, would have represented a huge percentage raise. Today, it’s market.

Pay it or don’t, and reap the rewards of competence…..or the difficulty of growing pains. Or worse, incompetence.

But one way or the other, you will pay.

I don’t like it. I also wish a lot of fictional gift-givers were real. They’re not, so I think we are better off dealing with it.

4QTBC, it wasn’t you I was alluding to and for what it’s worth, I agree with everything you said in this post.
RTR

 

[lowend]

The change in tax law that stopped people from getting a deduction for things like Tide Pride caused a lot of people to walk away too.

I told an Auburn graduate acquaintance the other day that the best thing they did to Jordan-Hare was not expanding it. Bryant-Denny is just too big now. If you're at the tops of the upper deck, you'd might as well watch at home because you're just watching the screens. You can't hear the band anymore in half the stadium. The prices are outrageous. I can't afford TP, so I'll keep being a fan that doesn't matter to my alma mater, picking up tickets to the one cupcake game a year we can afford because my kids are still excited about going.

 

[4Q Basket Case]

I think that so long as the team is a consistent contender for championships, they'll be able to sell out the TP memberships. Keep in mind that there's a surprising amount of non-TP seating -- students, faculty and staff, and visitors' allocations take up more volume than you might think.

Now, what happens when Saban hangs it up is another question entirely.

It would also be interesting to do a study on market value for the combination of TP donation and tickets themselves. You'd have to take into account location of seating, so it would be a pretty complex operation, and I've never seen it done at scale.

All in, between TP and the tickets, the Basket Case household is in at way above market for games against non-conference directional schools. But we're in at significantly under the secondary market for UTw, LSU, and UTe.

What's the net, taking into account the specific seat location? I don't know.

 

[81usaf92]

But we're in at but significantly under the secondary market for UTw, LSU, and UTe.

That’s not necessarily true. Adding the donation fee with the cost the tickets could potentially be the same or higher for TP members. It’s really Face value plus donation.

My friend has 45 yard line seats and we figured it up one year and compared it to seat geek, and he was actually paying more for season tickets that if he would have bought anything individually. The only reason he keeps them is because of the 1 or 2 games his family all comes or he has a client looking for tickets. Plus he is high in points.

I went to all but two home games (both directional schools) from 14-19. I only saw above 200 Buck seats at game time twice. That was for 14 Auburn and 19 lsu. Point is these 2011 lsu games really don’t exist anymore for tickets. Sure Texas is probably going to test that theory, but I’m reminded that this year IN Austin we only paid $250 because we wanted seats not in the end zone. But Tennessee and LSU could be either under $100 or in between $100 and $250 depending on how each team is doing.

TP really is about the comfort of your seating arrangement more than the cost of a ticket.

 

[4Q Basket Case]

Our all-in cost --TP and tickets -- is a hair under $400 a pair, per game, assuming all 7 home games are equally weighted. That's obviously way over market on the lesser games.

So I looked on Seat Geek for UTw, UTe and LSU. To be as close as possible to a valid comparison, I checked the available tickets nearest our seat location and found:
-- UTw $600 each / $1,200 per pair
-- UTe $500 each / $1,000 per pair
-- LSU $460 each / $920 per pair

Now, that's today, asking isn't getting, and you don't know what prices might be closer to game time. They tend to go down, but depending on how the teams are doing, that might or might not hold.

Still, it would appear that I could sell those three games (six tickets), come out a bit ahead, and still have four games, including Ole Miss, Arkansas, Middle Tennessee and Chattanooga.

I'd also miss being in the stadium for those games, and run the risk of (1) irritating my neighbors if opposing fans bought them, and (2) attracting the attention of the Tide Pride police.

So it would take some big health or financial changes at the Basket Case household to make me want to do that. But at least today the option is there.

 

[uafan4life]

I wouldn’t call the stated price of the ticket a “massive discount”….

I was referring to the donation, directly.

However, even indirectly, the distributed cost of the divided portion of the donation plus the face value of the tickets for big games was - for some members of Tide Pride - a massive discount over what those tickets would have cost on the secondary market. Meanwhile, many other members of Tide Pride were paying far more than secondary market prices for their seats in order to obtain the ancillary benefits previously mentioned as well as support the program.

That anyone would make - with a straight face - as foolish a statement as comparing the face value of their Tide Pride tickets to ones ordered through the ticket office, as if that's a viable option for any tickets remotely close to the seating value of the tickets offered through Tide Pride, shows just how out-of-touch that line of thinking is.

Those types of tickets are only available to the average fan in one of two ways: Tide Pride and the secondary markets. You can't compare something you have in hand with a fictitious version that doesn't exist...

 

[uafan4life]

Yeah and this is the common argument for every hard core TP supporter.

Yet we keep seeing Bryne’s plans taking sizable detours after no one ponies up, we see discounted tickets, and we see them begging current TP members to buy extra seats.

The truth is that every game being televised and the evolution in entertainment technologies has totally killed sports attendance. It’s to the point that 75% to 80% capacity is about the closest you are ever going to get to full capacity. So what tends to happen is that when the older crowd either gets peeved because stadium renovations move them, just tired of doing it, or just can’t anymore they start to finally get new people. Those new people are far less dependable on average because they 1) haven’t been paying the donations and 2) really haven’t factored in how much going to games costs.

Unless you are just committed to certain seats then there are really no huge advantages to TP because all of the massive benefits are for those higher in points. I kinda see TP becoming more like a baseball season ticket club down the line because of the lack of commitment from newer members.

I've done plenty of the math and data analysis - all of which, in this particular context, is quite simple - to know very well that, on average, Tide Pride is not a particularly cost-efficient manner of purchasing tickets. However, I'm also well aware that it isn't nearly as much of a disparity as many bemoaners want to claim.

You cannot compare the cost of simply attending the games - especially using the best bang-for-your-buck seating location you can find from game to game, especially with a variable basement for location preference - with the total cost of Tide Pride membership plus tickets. You have to - at a bare minimum - compare consistent, average pricing for the specific locations allocated to the various Tide Pride levels on the secondary market in advance.

And it won't be a fair comparison unless you also factor in the additional costs of the ancillary benefits accompanying the membership - such as parking benefits, the security of knowing one's seating location for the entire season, and the potential for purchasing post-season tickets at face value. While these benefits certainly carry more weight with some individuals than others, ignoring them completely makes any comparison immediately invalid.

As for your reference to my statement(s) being "the common argument for every hard core TP supporter" - well, I didn't proffer any anticipated resolution, only stating that the proposed solution was a definite way to draw a concrete (rather than imagined) conclusion.

If you are correct in your assertions, then Tide Pride would see a relatively quick adjustment down to at least something close to what the market would justify.

If you are incorrect, of course, we would see no changes.

And if you are also correct in your assertion that the number of Tide Pride memberships being cancelled is that significant, then we should be able to draw a conclusion quite quickly...

 

[9gks]

You totally miss my point.
The face value on my tickets are the same as tickets obtained thru the ticket office, so I get no discount. As I’m sure you know, we pay a donation amount per ticket each year. When joined 20 yrs ago that amount was $80 each. The last two years that amount had increased to $110 each. That’s a reasonable increase.
But to almost triple that amount in one year?
That figure is now $300.
If that’s reasonable for you, money must not be a concern.

Speaking as someone that sits close to section C that sounds like a bargain to me

 

[4Q Basket Case]

I've done plenty of the math and data analysis - all of which, in this particular context, is quite simple - to know very well that, on average, Tide Pride is not a particularly cost-efficient manner of purchasing tickets. However, I'm also well aware that it isn't nearly as much of a disparity as many bemoaners want to claim.

You cannot compare the cost of simply attending the games - especially using the best bang-for-your-buck seating location you can find from game to game, especially with a variable basement for location preference - with the total cost of Tide Pride membership plus tickets. You have to - at a bare minimum - compare consistent, average pricing for the specific locations allocated to the various Tide Pride levels on the secondary market in advance.

And it won't be a fair comparison unless you also factor in the additional costs of the ancillary benefits accompanying the membership - such as parking benefits, the security of knowing one's seating location for the entire season, and the potential for purchasing post-season tickets at face value. While these benefits certainly carry more weight with some individuals than others, ignoring them completely makes any comparison immediately invalid.

As for your reference to my statement(s) being "the common argument for every hard core TP supporter" - well, I didn't proffer any anticipated resolution, only stating that the proposed solution was a definite way to draw a concrete (rather than imagined) conclusion.

If you are correct in your assertions, then Tide Pride would see a relatively quick adjustment down to at least something close to what the market would justify.

If you are incorrect, of course, we would see no changes.

And if you are also correct in your assertion that the number of Tide Pride memberships being cancelled is that significant, then we should be able to draw a conclusion quite quickly...

Generally speaking, we’re on the same page. I do disagree in that I think that TP is relatively efficient, especially at the Touchdown Club and higher….IF you go to all the games.

If you don’t, it can still work if you sell the more popular games, and attend the lesser ones. Thing is, most people do exactly the opposite. And it would appear that TP is now monitoring both sales and attendance, prioritizing people who actually show up in person without selling.

Further, I’d guess that people who fit that profile also donate more money separate and apart from TP or ticket purchases. Which, believe me, can be many times the required financial commitment.

So there might very well be another aspect to the calculus.

Lots of moving parts, but we’re on one page in that it comes down to money.

If you want a $10M head coach, a couple of $2.5 - $3M coordinators and a bunch of $500K+ assistants, an army of support staff, and the best facilities in the country, that’s what it takes.

Keep in mind, we haven’t touched NIL with any of that.

Emotional loyalty doesn’t buy a single bit of that. Financial loyalty does.

I wish it were different. We have to deal with the world at it is, not as we wish it were.

 

[TrampLineman]

We're getting out of TP, this would have been year 30 but once the donations more than tripled we're done.

 

[Crimson1967]

I hope TPTB are aware that a series of 8-4 non-playoff seasons (or worse) in the post-Saban era will significantly reduce demand for tickets at the current price structure.

 

[Vinny]

I’ve been in U4 LL, row 2 since 1998 when they gave TP members first crack at the upper deck expansion. I had 2 tickets in the lower corner bowl all the way up top. I was paying for 4 seats and four donations until 2003 when I couldn’t afford it any more. Now I have 3 tickets in my section. We don’t make it down every year and 2019 was the last season we were down for a game. We might be coming to the Texas game, but that might interfere with my son’s sport schedule on that day.

 

[Ratal]

The donations tripled this year, or over time?

 

[uafan4life]

The donations tripled this year, or over time?

Nothing tripled this year...

 

[uafan4life]

We're getting out of TP, this would have been year 30 but once the donations more than tripled we're done.

You do realize that costs tripling over 30 years constitutes less than a 50% increase over just inflation, right?

 

[JohnD]

Nothing tripled this year...

My TP went from 160 to 500 this year.

 

[uafan4life]

My TP went from 160 to 500 this year.

I was talking about the total cost: donation + tickets.

Yes, your donation cost might have tripled but your ticket cost went down, so it was really only about a 33% increase in total cost...

 

[2003TIDE]

So update we got to keep tickets upon appeal. Not sure what the point of this nonsense was and it was a waste of time for both sides. They could have sent out warning messaging with renewals saying you need to attend x number of games or lose your tickets and accomplish the same thing.