Fauci's diary released - he lied?

Exactly... Because he changed his mind and firmed up his opinions as more data became available? Because he was able to interact and discuss with coronavirus specialists in the first six months and learned more?

It shows how dumb the Republicans are and how they are playing games that they act like any commentary in those early days is a "gotcha" moment if it changed in accordance with the growing body of data.
If it had only had been that, many would have been fine with it. The hardcore MAGA obviously were always going to complain about something. From my seat, the problem was that he didn't just do that. He weaponized the vaccine then when it didn't keep you from getting it, he kept changing the definition of what a vaccine is and had amnesia about what was originally promised. I think the vaccinate your kids including newborns also was a major problem. Obviously these comments aren't really on topic about this whole Congressional hearing subject. These are just my general observations as someone frustrated by both parties. I think being ****ed off by Fauci and how he did things doesn't automatically make you a MAGA person. The tone of this thread certainly indicates that a large percentage of those well to the left disagree with that. It feels like if you don't like Fauci you're a fascist. In reality, many of us aren't dumb and do think some shady crap went on that should at least be discussed.
 
It's called "the scientific method." Early, they concentrated on fomite transmission, because of the flu analogy. That was very logical at that point. Then, when the fragility of the virus on most surfaces became obvious, they dropped it. As always, the chorus from the right was "You lied!!" Idiocy!

Well it’s because the Republicans have to distract from Taco Bell COVID and the global crisis that they created in the Middle East. But actually reading within context of the diary it doesn’t seem to be as damning as Republicans and Anti Fauci folks make it out to be. Embarrassing yes but it shows more of an evolution of his thinking on the origin than just him lying to defend his first theory about it. Like I said…. It looks more like a vendetta by Paul and a last ditch effort by the GOP for the midterms.
 
If it had only had been that, many would have been fine with it. The hardcore MAGA obviously were always going to complain about something. From my seat, the problem was that he didn't just do that. He weaponized the vaccine then when it didn't keep you from getting it, he kept changing the definition of what a vaccine is and had amnesia about what was originally promised. I think the vaccinate your kids including newborns also was a major problem. Obviously these comments aren't really on topic about this whole Congressional hearing subject. These are just my general observations as someone frustrated by both parties. I think being ****ed off by Fauci and how he did things doesn't automatically make you a MAGA person. The tone of this thread certainly indicates that a large percentage of those well to the left disagree with that. It feels like if you don't like Fauci you're a fascist. In reality, many of us aren't dumb and do think some shady crap went on that should at least be discussed.
Just drink your Kool-Aid and stop your griping.

e9a2f53b2195547f24b43feae949e1c3.jpg
 
If it had only had been that, many would have been fine with it. The hardcore MAGA obviously were always going to complain about something. From my seat, the problem was that he didn't just do that. He weaponized the vaccine then when it didn't keep you from getting it, he kept changing the definition of what a vaccine is and had amnesia about what was originally promised. I think the vaccinate your kids including newborns also was a major problem. Obviously these comments aren't really on topic about this whole Congressional hearing subject. These are just my general observations as someone frustrated by both parties. I think being ****ed off by Fauci and how he did things doesn't automatically make you a MAGA person. The tone of this thread certainly indicates that a large percentage of those well to the left disagree with that. It feels like if you don't like Fauci you're a fascist. In reality, many of us aren't dumb and do think some shady crap went on that should at least be discussed.

The whole deal with stating the COVID vaccine was not a vaccine because it didn't prevent COVID was manufactured. I spent time working in vaccine research in the early 2000s and the concept of therapeutic vaccines for treatment of illnesses after they began had been established for decades. Unfortunately, while fruitful from a basic science vantage and understanding the immune system and how it interacts with cancer, most of our cancer vaccines have not had the effectiveness we'd like. Also - the initial COVID vaccine studies showed pretty solid prevention of COVID transmission, so it was not wrong to say that it could prevent COVID. However, subsequent studies showed a lesser effect on prevention of transmission, closer to 50% in keeping with other vaccines for respiratory pathogens (flu vaccine being a prime example). But... the effect on the severity of illness from an infection was very impressive. Massive reductions in severe illness and death. Estimates through 2025 suggest 2-3 million deaths averted and 17-22 million hospitalizations averted. I can tell you on the ground that by mid-2021 my patients had stopped dying if vaccinated. Was it perfect? No... but it was a solid result indeed.

Infants aged 6-24 months were more prone to developing severe infections, thus the impetus to have an option for them. There has never been an approval or significant trial looking at the vaccination of newborns (technical definition there is the first 30 days of life). My personal belief was that healthy people under the age of 65 could decide on their own to get vaccinated, with the realization that vaccination essentially wins out over not vaccination at every age and health status. My objection was to all of the misinformation that was spread during that time. I gave my teenagers the option for vaccination or not and they all took it. My son told me that if he could prevent one person from being infected and dying due to taking it, that he felt it was his civic duty. I mean heck, if you are unhealthy or over 65, that is your prerogative to get vaccinated, but I wanted people to be aware of the risk to benefit ration.

I mean, if you disagree with Fauci, that is reasonable. Like most people who achieve his level of success, he is arrogant and self assured and has fought many political battles. But you have to deal with facts and the reality of what was happening on the ground. The vast majority of the hatred directed towards him is pretty unreasonable. As for shady stuff, well... Look at who he worked for! But honestly, so much of the shady stuff is conspiracy theory without anything substantial presented as evidence.
 
I did not. A friend had a stroke and his doctor said it was likely because of the vaccine. I believe the doctor was pro covid vaccine, so there's that.
Like literally any medication or procedure, there is adherently some risk to getting jabbed. I got two, but declined boosters after hearing about the myocarditis and pericarditis risks associated with the Moderna and Pfizer shots. I already have a pre-existing heart condition; the last thing I needed was to introduce another contributing factor.
 
  • Like
Reactions: dayhiker
De
Well it’s because the Republicans have to distract from Taco Bell COVID and the global crisis that they created in the Middle East. But actually reading within context of the diary it doesn’t seem to be as damning as Republicans and Anti Fauci folks make it out to be. Embarrassing yes but it shows more of an evolution of his thinking on the origin than just him lying to defend his first theory about it. Like I said…. It looks more like a vendetta by Paul and a last ditch effort by the GOP for the midterms.

More common sense from those rascally "far left" folks who think science should be a thing.

I'm always laughing at people who are claiming not to be MAGA, but parroting everything MAGA stands for.
 
The whole deal with stating the COVID vaccine was not a vaccine because it didn't prevent COVID was manufactured. I spent time working in vaccine research in the early 2000s and the concept of therapeutic vaccines for treatment of illnesses after they began had been established for decades. Unfortunately, while fruitful from a basic science vantage and understanding the immune system and how it interacts with cancer, most of our cancer vaccines have not had the effectiveness we'd like. Also - the initial COVID vaccine studies showed pretty solid prevention of COVID transmission, so it was not wrong to say that it could prevent COVID. However, subsequent studies showed a lesser effect on prevention of transmission, closer to 50% in keeping with other vaccines for respiratory pathogens (flu vaccine being a prime example). But... the effect on the severity of illness from an infection was very impressive. Massive reductions in severe illness and death. Estimates through 2025 suggest 2-3 million deaths averted and 17-22 million hospitalizations averted. I can tell you on the ground that by mid-2021 my patients had stopped dying if vaccinated. Was it perfect? No... but it was a solid result indeed.

Infants aged 6-24 months were more prone to developing severe infections, thus the impetus to have an option for them. There has never been an approval or significant trial looking at the vaccination of newborns (technical definition there is the first 30 days of life). My personal belief was that healthy people under the age of 65 could decide on their own to get vaccinated, with the realization that vaccination essentially wins out over not vaccination at every age and health status. My objection was to all of the misinformation that was spread during that time. I gave my teenagers the option for vaccination or not and they all took it. My son told me that if he could prevent one person from being infected and dying due to taking it, that he felt it was his civic duty. I mean heck, if you are unhealthy or over 65, that is your prerogative to get vaccinated, but I wanted people to be aware of the risk to benefit ration.

I mean, if you disagree with Fauci, that is reasonable. Like most people who achieve his level of success, he is arrogant and self assured and has fought many political battles. But you have to deal with facts and the reality of what was happening on the ground. The vast majority of the hatred directed towards him is pretty unreasonable. As for shady stuff, well... Look at who he worked for! But honestly, so much of the shady stuff is conspiracy theory without anything substantial presented as evidence.
Thinking back, the one size fits all solutions likely contributed to the venom. Take the shot now or else versus, hey, lose weight if you're overweight, get vitamin D, exercise, and if you don't have risk factors, you might want to sit this one out.

I think your comments about his arrogance, self assuredness, and level of success are spot on too. His press conference presence was problematic. I don't know that his arrogance was an issue for me. He did come across as inauthentic to me.
 
The whole deal with stating the COVID vaccine was not a vaccine because it didn't prevent COVID was manufactured. I spent time working in vaccine research in the early 2000s and the concept of therapeutic vaccines for treatment of illnesses after they began had been established for decades. Unfortunately, while fruitful from a basic science vantage and understanding the immune system and how it interacts with cancer, most of our cancer vaccines have not had the effectiveness we'd like. Also - the initial COVID vaccine studies showed pretty solid prevention of COVID transmission, so it was not wrong to say that it could prevent COVID. However, subsequent studies showed a lesser effect on prevention of transmission, closer to 50% in keeping with other vaccines for respiratory pathogens (flu vaccine being a prime example). But... the effect on the severity of illness from an infection was very impressive. Massive reductions in severe illness and death. Estimates through 2025 suggest 2-3 million deaths averted and 17-22 million hospitalizations averted. I can tell you on the ground that by mid-2021 my patients had stopped dying if vaccinated. Was it perfect? No... but it was a solid result indeed.

Infants aged 6-24 months were more prone to developing severe infections, thus the impetus to have an option for them. There has never been an approval or significant trial looking at the vaccination of newborns (technical definition there is the first 30 days of life). My personal belief was that healthy people under the age of 65 could decide on their own to get vaccinated, with the realization that vaccination essentially wins out over not vaccination at every age and health status. My objection was to all of the misinformation that was spread during that time. I gave my teenagers the option for vaccination or not and they all took it. My son told me that if he could prevent one person from being infected and dying due to taking it, that he felt it was his civic duty. I mean heck, if you are unhealthy or over 65, that is your prerogative to get vaccinated, but I wanted people to be aware of the risk to benefit ration.

I mean, if you disagree with Fauci, that is reasonable. Like most people who achieve his level of success, he is arrogant and self assured and has fought many political battles. But you have to deal with facts and the reality of what was happening on the ground. The vast majority of the hatred directed towards him is pretty unreasonable. As for shady stuff, well... Look at who he worked for! But honestly, so much of the shady stuff is conspiracy theory without anything substantial presented as evidence.
PS, I really appreciate all of this first hand information from the perspective of a physician who went through it. Thank you.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bamamc1 and Con
In the event that was directed at me, I use science every day with work. I also don't parrot MAGA.

I think it was more directed at how the timing of this isn’t conveniently when the Republicans are facing the firing squad over the Iran War, the Epstein files, and the new viral issues. We now know that how this diary was leaked was thru RFK Jr’s access to it. So why are we reigniting this now when RFK and Rand have had access to this information for 2 years???

Nothing new has really came out of this. It is a grandstanding show designed to bring back the anger of 2019 and 2020.
 
  • Thank You
Reactions: UAH and 92tide

I can't see how this helps in the midterms, but I'm not very savvy wrt how MAGA supporters think, despite knowing quite a few of them.
i don't think it will. trump (and basically the g.o.p. at this point) is a one trick pony. smears and distraction are all he knows how to do. unfortunately for the rest of us, it's been too successful of a "strategy" for the past 10 years
 
PS, I really appreciate all of this first hand information from the perspective of a physician who went through it. Thank you.

No expert for sure, but much of my training and practice were definitely adjacent to the issues. COVID was tough all the way around, and part of that I didn't really experience because I went to work every day and didn't face the loss of a job or the social isolation. 2020 was a pretty good year personally...

In part, COVID wasn't dangerous enough... If we'd had a smallpox outbreak and 30% of the infected died, we'd have seen greater acceptance of quarantine procedures. I've always wondered if we had gone all in to hyperlocalize our tracking and quarantines and just tried to get everyone to wear N-95s in public if we'd have had similar results and much less confusion and anger. We wore standard protective gear in the hospital when seeing patients, and the rates of nosocomial infection and transmission amongst healthcare workers was low, mainly due to N-95s and hand washing. These thoughts and 6$ will get you a starbucks!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 92tide
I think it was more directed at how the timing of this isn’t conveniently when the Republicans are facing the firing squad over the Iran War, the Epstein files, and the new viral issues. We now know that how this diary was leaked was thru RFK Jr’s access to it. So why are we reigniting this now when RFK and Rand have had access to this information for 2 years???

Nothing new has really came out of this. It is a grandstanding show designed to bring back the anger of 2019 and 2020.
To those who somehow think a nuclear armed Iran is a good thing or even could be allowed to happen, I will leave this from one of your qon ilk not so very long ago:

 
  • Like
Reactions: Huckleberry
Advertisement

Trending content

Advertisement

Latest threads