I noticed someone else commented on the procedure--preliminary hearing to determine probable cause then on to a Grand Jury. If indicted, then the process begins with an arraignment. However, there is something called "pleading guilty on information" that an accused person may do BEFORE a preliminary hearing, at a preliminary hearing or sometime BEFORE the Grand Jury meets. If you plan to ask for Youthful Offender status, you do that AFTER you are indicted by a Grand Jury. With the confessions on record, I do not believe that YO will be granted, but the defense attorney MUST ask for it. You can guarantee that if these kids have a sudden change of heart, they will attack the Miranda warnings with vengeance. Obviously, if they were to prevail, this doesn't make them any less guilty in reality, they just get off on a technicality.
Oh good grief! That's not at all what I said. I've pointed out that Saban has a fraction of the amount of trouble of some of the other schools, AU and UGA specifically, and, bad as this was, no one got killed or robbed at gunpoint. You were the one who brought up that, when our kids did get into trouble, that it was pretty bad. All I did was point out that there is a quantitative difference, and viewed objectively against gun play and death by firearm, there's also a qualitative difference. This is our first serious problem in five years, so I'm not going to rush to hang Saban...
Some of these guys - and I'm not going to say which ones - have had drug test problems and the vending machines do sound a bit like MJ munchies. However, usually, MJ has been mixed with something else when there are extremely violent incidents. Williams' actions, in particular, seem to be fueled by rage, with probably some chemical help...
You seem to not be reading, he answered that already - the sheer numbers are the difference.
This is a sad state of affairs. Really makes you stop and think about what has become of our society, and where it could go.
"Mark Richt has lost control of ..." is not a meme because of a single, isolated instance, but because of a long history of instances.
The number of incidents are different as well as the approach to recruiting but the I believe the response has been different too. Some other schools have excused illegal behavior repeatedly in some players, until it could not be ignored. That lead to a culture in their programs that Coach Saban will not tolerate.
I'm sorry, that just makes no sense to me whatever. In my job if someone who is working for me screws up I get questioned about it. The fact that it doesn't happen a lot doesn't give me immunity from being question or being ultimately responsible. I wish that was the case, but in the world I live in I'm responsible even if something goes wrong once every 10 years.
I believe if we begin to see a pattern, or an indication that something is not right in the program, you would see a response of exactly the kind you are questioning. This incident, the first in a while, is only a few players that have gone bonkers for whatever reason. Just like innocent until proven guilty, I'll wait for a little more evidence before I equate CNS's program with others that have had far more frequent incidents than this one. It's not bias, it's confidence in CNS and 'The Process', that this incident is the anomaly, and not the norm.
I agree with you. (and to be clear this is nt directed at you) Poverty is not a character flaw. I hate it when people act like it is. I grew wanting a great deal more than I ever had. Never beat anyone unconscious and/or robbed them. People rich and poor have character flaws about equally and when something like this happens and poverty is offered as a reason or excuse or someone flat out says having money makes it easier to behave better....well, I become incensed because the implication is that all poor people have a character flaw. How insulting! Yeah, so you were poor. So you almost went down that road. It wasn't because you were poor. It was because of something else, but if it wasn't easy money you were after it would have been easy something else or because you like having power or whatever the motivation....but you (then) didn't want to put the time and effort in to do things the right way. You want respect? Being a bully is not the way to go about it. Want money or what it can buy? Stealing is not the way to do it. But those things are sometimes easier than behaving with good character and dignity and respect for yourself and others. And to anyone offering poverty as an excuse I'd say Stop it! All you are doing is insulting every poor person I've ever known.
but your premise that somehow Nick Saban is not being held responsible for this matter is absurd. you are attacking a strawman.
I don't think anyone did that, and I'm inclined to agree with almost everything you said. I said before and I'll say again that poverty is not an excuse for crime, and these players are not really poor anyway. There is socioeconomic data and factors that clearly indicate certain circumstances are more conducive to certain crimes, but it is never an excuse and it's never right to insinuate that someone is more likely to do wrong because they are not as well off as someone else. In fact, there is also data to indicate that people who are privileged are more likely to mistreat others.
And, with that reply, I see no point in continuing this discussion. Let's let it drop...
We live in a world with public 'I-Spy Cameras'. Wonder if they are on video either there or in the vicinity? Photo capability similar to an ATM maybe.
