I feel Saban is getting fed up with JPW

Tidewater

FB|NS|NSNP Moderator
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Mar 15, 2003
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yeah those whole two plays he was in for. yep that determined a whole lot about him :p_eyes:
Greg McElroy has gone 8-9 for 73 yards, no picks, 1 touchdown. The one incompletion was a deliberate throwaway, on a play in which everyone was well covered. Now, the fourth quarter against Western Carolina is not the same level of intensity (and opponent's talent) as the first quarter against Auburn, but GM has done everything that the the staff has asked him to do on the field and done it flawlessly.
Even compensating for the dynamic that the most popular player on the team is the second string QB, I have to wonder just how poorly a player has to play before his back-up would get a chance.
CNS has shown a complete willingness to replace DBs.
I just don't get this. I know that, if JPW plays up to his potential, he can be absolutely unbeatable. The question remains, will he?
 

92tide

TideFans Legend
May 9, 2000
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My answer was always that time slows down for me in a tight situation and I'm able to calmly assess my alternatives.
earle,

maybe it was all of those "safety meetings" held on the side of the river discussing the upcoming drops. the ones at soc em dog always seemed to slow down the day ;)

btw, i know what you mean. the survival instinct becomes second nature, almost subconscious. i've been able to place a crucial paddle stroke on the lip of a 25 foot waterfall without even thinking about it, but i would probably crap my pants if titus brown was running after me ;)
 

CapstoneTider

Suspended
Dec 6, 2000
7,453
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I think there have been many, many, many times this season where JP should have been given a break to come in and get his head on straight.
I agree to a lesser degree. I will be glad when Greg McElroy gets an opportunity to play if to not only answer the million dollar question: "Is Greg McElroy that bad?" I bet he's aware of it and hope that his answer is a resounding "No!"
 

crimsonaudio

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Sep 9, 2002
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Even compensating for the dynamic that the most popular player on the team is the second string QB, I have to wonder just how poorly a player has to play before his back-up would get a chance.
CNS has shown a complete willingness to replace DBs.
I just don't get this. I know that, if JPW plays up to his potential, he can be absolutely unbeatable. The question remains, will he?
Well, again, you're making a judgment based on very limited data, while CNS and staff get to see the QB's work every day. How do you know GM doesn't throw 50% picks vs the D every day in practice?

Second guessing an experienced coaching staff is ludicrous unless the decision making is obviously faulty. I would suggest that's not the case here.
 

quince

BamaNation Citizen
Jul 25, 2007
71
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This was a team effort.
JPW had more INT return yds than passing yards
Rashad Johnson dropped two ints
Nikita Stover dropped a TD pass
Keith Brown dropped 2 passes
DL & lbs overran 5-6 sacks
Marcus Carter was ........
Nick Walker fumbled the ball backwards 15 yards
The textbook 5 players who could have made difference
Hey, don't interject logic into this.....It confuses the masses!
 

BFANLC

Suspended
Nov 25, 2005
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In a dream world
Throwing that interception right before halftime was the worst thing JPW could have done, but if you've got first and goal from the three, poor lay from the OL combined with poor play calling
Not saying a word..:rolleyes:


My only two questions would be is if we are losing what does it hurt to get your backup some playing time anyway?And my second would be what happens if JP gets hurt? None of our backup qbs have any valuable playing time. You would think that getting them some playing time would be a priority even without JPs poor play.
 

OrngAntipathist

Scout Team
Jan 29, 2007
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...anyone who thinks this team is anywhere near being able to compete with the barn for 60 minutes is sadly mistaken.
Funny, I said something similar to a co-worker AU fan and he feels the exact same way about his team. He said AUs corners can't defend passes thrown up for grabs because they don't ever look for the ball...and that's all that JP throws. And he was dead serious. I had to laugh at that one. Most knowledgeable AU fans I know feel like we do. It depends on which team and QB shows up. The QBs are either heros or chokers, never in between. Could be a really good game this year.

However, I think CNS is getting fed up with JPW and many others. If you just watch his reactions to numerous plays throughout last game you can see it...JPW, offensive line, defense...its more frustrating to CNS to lose than anyone on this board. PERIOD! And that's why I feel so good about the upcoming years. ROLL TIDE!
 

trenda

Hall of Fame
May 17, 2000
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OR, our backups just aren't good. I can't imagine that's the case, but I personally don't know what other conclusion to come to. I think there have been many, many, many times this season where JP should have been given a break to come in and get his head on straight. Hasn't happened, so either JP isn't doing as bad as I thought and I'm just extremely critical about over throwing, underthrowing, keying in on one receiver, not reading zone defenses, etc; or we don't have other options.
My sentiments exactly. JPW is obviously our best option at QB or someone else would be playing. It makes me really wonder, though, why JPW isn't spelled for a series when he is having such a rough time of it.
 

trenda

Hall of Fame
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Well, again, you're making a judgment based on very limited data, while CNS and staff get to see the QB's work every day. How do you know GM doesn't throw 50% picks vs the D every day in practice?

Second guessing an experienced coaching staff is ludicrous unless the decision making is obviously faulty. I would suggest that's not the case here.
I don't see any harm in questioning why GM hasn't spelled JPW for a series when he's struggling. Although it's only limited data, GM's stats don't give much credence to thinking that he's throwing 50% interceptions in practice or that he's not capable of running the offense effectively.

2007 A-Day Game
14-33-0, 139 yds, 1 TD playing with the second string against, I believe, the 1st string defense.
2007 Western Carolina
8-9-0, 73 yds, 1 TD
2007 UT
Handed the ball off without turning it over on a couple of plays

When you're QB is only completing 47% of his passes, has more passing yards to the opposing team than to his own team, is clearly rattled, throws three straight passes into the stands when he has open receivers, and scrambles on a play where he has no pressure on him, I'd say it's fair game to question why he's still in the game. It's hard to imagine GM doing any worse for a series than JPW did in that game - particularly at that point.

While Saban and staff are definitely experienced, they are not beyond making mistakes. He's already admitted to faulty decision-making on a couple of occasions already this season. I don't think anyone is questioning the coaching staff's ability (at least I'm not) or competence; but to second guess things that don't go, or aren't going, right is only natural. No one is perfect.
 

lostinNala

3rd Team
Nov 6, 2007
211
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Guntersville, Alabama
My .02:

This type of over-critical analysis hurts our chances of obtaining blue chip recruits and of retaining highly touted, proven coaches. This is exactly the kind of over-blown expectations CNS was talking about at the beginning of the year.

I am not arguing that JPW is the greatest, or that his play does not warrant some criticism, but the fact, for better or worse, is that (1) he is the best option we have right now (if you have any faith in CNS' ability to properly evaluate players on the practice field); and (2) he has had problems with consistency, but we are very quick to forget his positive play.

JPW has shown flashes of being a solid playmaker at QB in our route of UF under CMS; this year's Arkansas game; our route of UT, and the last second drive to tie up the UGA game and force OT.

The truth is our 5th year senior class is light by over 5 scollys; and the further effects of NCAA sanctions made it harder to pull top flight recruits to UA in the first few seasons after sanctions lifted. You still have a 1st yr. coach, playing with someone elses' NCAA battered recruits. Further still, the OL has been playing musical chairs, w/ 3 starters missing due to injury or suspension.
 

BamaSteve999

1st Team
Oct 22, 2004
403
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I was at the game Saturday, and if memory serves there were at least 4 occasions where I told my wife "the cornerback is blitzing and leaving ________ in single coverage" where the safety did not roll up in coverage. Not once did we just stand up and throw it out there for the 6-10 yard gain, not to mention slowing down the blitz. Maybe it's coincidental that each of these were coming from JPW's blind side.

It's fairly obvious that JPW does not do a great job reading pre-snap and does not do well at all under pressure, but then again that is the whole purpose of getting pressure on a QB. Also begs the question of why we are still having that much pressure on him. All in all, I think it just goes to show that Saban and crew will need more than one year to fix the mess the previous staff left us.
 

crtide

1st Team
Jul 19, 2007
328
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Gadsden, AL
My .02:

This type of over-critical analysis hurts our chances of obtaining blue chip recruits and of retaining highly touted, proven coaches. This is exactly the kind of over-blown expectations CNS was talking about at the beginning of the year.

I am not arguing that JPW is the greatest, or that his play does not warrant some criticism, but the fact, for better or worse, is that (1) he is the best option we have right now (if you have any faith in CNS' ability to properly evaluate players on the practice field); and (2) he has had problems with consistency, but we are very quick to forget his positive play.

JPW has shown flashes of being a solid playmaker at QB in our route of UF under CMS; this year's Arkansas game; our route of UT, and the last second drive to tie up the UGA game and force OT.

The truth is our 5th year senior class is light by over 5 scollys; and the further effects of NCAA sanctions made it harder to pull top flight recruits to UA in the first few seasons after sanctions lifted. You still have a 1st yr. coach, playing with someone elses' NCAA battered recruits. Further still, the OL has been playing musical chairs, w/ 3 starters missing due to injury or suspension.
Sorry, that was Croyle.
 

crimsonaudio

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As it's been stated over and over, it's not all at JPW's feet - receivers have to catch catchable balls, linemen/RB's have to pick up blocks and blitzes, etc.

That being said, unless people can stop taking pot shots at our starting QB, we'll shut this thread down. You may not like his play at times, but he works 1000X harder than any poster on this board to win the games and he wears the Crimson Jersey, and we're not going to let him be reduced to a piñata.
 

CornBiscuit

Suspended
Oct 2, 2005
4,386
0
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Mobile, AL
As it's been stated over and over, it's not all at JPW's feet - receivers have to catch catchable balls, linemen/RB's have to pick up blocks and blitzes, etc.

That being said, unless people can stop taking pot shots at our starting QB, we'll shut this thread down. You may not like his play at times, but he works 1000X harder than any poster on this board to win the games and he wears the Crimson Jersey, and we're not going to let him be reduced to a piñata.
I think that is part of people's frustrations with him, because he has shown signs of being successful.

But at the same time is also frustrating because he will make a good throw under pressure and then get plenty of time to throw on the next play and either eat it and run or completely overthrow the guy. At least we know he can win games so lets hope that side comes out of him...it could be worse.
 

Alasippi

Suspended
Aug 31, 2007
12,875
2
57
Ocean Springs, MS
I've read every one of the posts and it seems to me that maybe I was watching a different game Saturday.
There is not one QB in the nation that would have had a chance to make a positive difference on the play before the half.
There was no way JPW could have thrown the ball away safely because he was immediately and completely smothered by Titus Brown.
So the idealist would say "Just take the sack and don't commit the turnover.".
Well unfortunately had JPW done the "smart" thing the half would have expired before we could have gotten our kicker on the field for a field goal.
Then everyone would be bashing JPW because he didn't throw the ball away.
Absolute no win situation for any QB on this play.

sippi
 

TexasTideFan

All-American
Feb 6, 2003
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Well unfortunately had JPW done the "smart" thing the half would have expired before we could have gotten our kicker on the field for a field goal.
Then everyone would be bashing JPW because he didn't throw the ball away.
Absolute no win situation for any QB on this play.
As bad as I hate for a QB to just take a sack, there are times when you have to. This was one of those times. He had no clue where the ball was going when he released it. JPW made another mistake, plain and simple.
 
Last edited:

Texas Tider

1st Team
Aug 19, 2004
435
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My .02:

This type of over-critical analysis hurts our chances of obtaining blue chip recruits and of retaining highly touted, proven coaches. This is exactly the kind of over-blown expectations CNS was talking about at the beginning of the year.
I don't think expecting our quarterback to be able to handle some pressure, to be able to see open receivers, and to not freeze up and be afraid to throw the ball would qualify as overblown expectations. What team doesn't expect that out of a quarterback?
 

Alasippi

Suspended
Aug 31, 2007
12,875
2
57
Ocean Springs, MS
As bad as I hate for a QB to just take a sack, there are times when you have to. This was one of those times. He had no clue where the ball was going when he released it. JPW made another mistake, plain and simple.
I'd almost bet my house that JPW's instructions on the last play were to throw to the receiver if he was open, to throw the ball away if he was covered and to under no circumstances to take the sack.
I could be wrong but that's typically the case in such situations.
At any rate I think JPW's a gutsy competitor and I think he's done an outstanding job overall.

sippi
 

bamar

1st Team
Mar 31, 2003
900
1
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tullahoma, tn usa
you know what is scary, we only have two or three games left, and most agree, we know less about our qb next year. i really worry about jpws ability to get the job done next year. i think he is traumatized, and he is hearing footsteps any time a def player gets near.
 

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