Jordan Palmer on what Bama fans can expect from Milroe 2024 (video)

[colbysullivan]

All the criticism of him doing this media thing or that and it all somehow relating back to him being a terrible QB...or to his most ardent detractors...not even a QB at all.

If he farted, some people would criticize the smell as proof he can't read a defense.

As for the film proving all his detractors correct, it would seem there is some debate about that even among people who are experts in the field.

IF it was an open and shut case that he's as awful as some say, why on earth would anyone in a position to decide even consider him as the starting QB?

Is it even possible that he's not as bad as some say...and not as good as other say?

Or is that not even debatable?

What on Earth are you talking about? There is tons of film showing WRs running all over the place, but Milroe...does...not...throw...the ball.

 

[CrimsonBloodn62]

What on Earth are you talking about? There is tons of film showing WRs running all over the place, but Milroe...does...not...throw...the ball.

Maybe some of them need to go back and watch some of the unOFFICIAL assistant coaches videos. He breaks his videos down with actual videos and facts. Then you have some poster that's not going to agree with any of Milroe's faults and claim some of us are wanting him to fail, which is the farthest thing from the truth.

 

[gtgilbert]

All the criticism of him doing this media thing or that and it all somehow relating back to him being a terrible QB...or to his most ardent detractors...not even a QB at all.

If he farted, some people would criticize the smell as proof he can't read a defense.

As for the film proving all his detractors correct, it would seem there is some debate about that even among people who are experts in the field.

IF it was an open and shut case that he's as awful as some say, why on earth would anyone in a position to decide even consider him as the starting QB?

Is it even possible that he's not as bad as some say...and not as good as other say?

Or is that not even debatable?

Well that's the great paradox of Milroe. Due to his physical tools, sometimes when he doesn't execute a play properly, he still makes something happen. The downside of that is that decent defenses can really limit his upside.

Case in point is the first play on the video Palmer uses. Milroe throws a pretty darn good ball for touchdown so that's a great play right?

Well, he had an obvious six man rush with only a six man protect, which meant an RB having to pass pro 1v1, so he should have known to be looking at a hot route instead of going deep. There was a hot route on the play to the TE, and it was WIDE OPEN. Palmer even mentions it. Milroe seems to be looking that way, but never throws the ball. For the record, Palmer is wrong about it being a bad snap at JMs ankles. The ball was placed well enough, just a hair to the right. JM muffed the catch and didn't collect it till it was almost on the ground. Even with that, there was still time to make the pass to 84. If that pass is made on time, the rush never gets close to pressuring him.

On the TD series I broke down (against AU or UGA - can't remember) where JM went 4-4, that was great right? Not really as it was the same thing where guys were open on schedule, but JM didn't throw it, so it turned into sandlot stuff and scrambling around hoping a WR would get back to an open space - thankfully Bond bailed us out. The shovel pass was perhaps the best example. JM totally screwed up by not throwing the ball on time. Guys were OPEN, really OPEN for a long time, but he never throws the ball, but then he pulls off the highlight worthy shovel pass once the play is broken. Same play, same player, being horrible one second and a highlight the next second. Thing is we wouldn't need the highlight play if he could just execute what was designed, called, and executed correctly by out other 10 guys on the field.

NFL scouts watching Burtons film from 23 said (and posted on twitter/X) that film review was watching him run great routes and being open a lot, but not getting the ball thrown his way.

PFF stats are the same way - total paradox: 9.2% big time throw rating is top 5ish as is his passing grade on deep passes. That's great. For short to intermediate, he was rated all the way down at the 100th best - that's right, 99QBs ahead of him. PFF had him as holding the ball an FBS WORST 3.45 seconds (and it was NOT play design, per all the statements above - routes where there to be executed sooner). PFF has had his pressure-to-sack ratio as 32.4% which is the 6th WORST in FBS. All those things are awful.

A-Day game this year - going 3 for 9, and clearly not making the right throws/reads on a lot of plays. The first drive alone JM mis-executed several reads and that continued through the game leading to JMs very obvious frustration.

Net - complete paradox, where the ceiling could be high, but unfortunately, the floor is also exceptionally low. Complete busts on play execution, but then a highlight on the same play.

It's boom-or-bust. many people see the boom and that's it. Unfortunately, there's a lot of busts (more busts than booms), and the busts really limit the overall efficiency of the offense, as the boom isn't really that reliable, and a big reason why the booms are needed is due to the busts from the same dude.

 

[BamaMoon]

Well that's the great paradox of Milroe. Due to his physical tools, sometimes when he doesn't execute a play properly, he still makes something happen. The downside of that is that decent defenses can really limit his upside.

Case in point is the first play on the video Palmer uses. Milroe throws a pretty darn good ball for touchdown so that's a great play right?

Well, he had an obvious six man rush with only a six man protect, which meant an RB having to pass pro 1v1, so he should have known to be looking at a hot route instead of going deep. There was a hot route on the play to the TE, and it was WIDE OPEN. Palmer even mentions it. Milroe seems to be looking that way, but never throws the ball. For the record, Palmer is wrong about it being a bad snap at JMs ankles. The ball was placed well enough, just a hair to the right. JM muffed the catch and didn't collect it till it was almost on the ground. Even with that, there was still time to make the pass to 84. If that pass is made on time, the rush never gets close to pressuring him.

On the TD series I broke down (against AU or UGA - can't remember) where JM went 4-4, that was great right? Not really as it was the same thing where guys were open on schedule, but JM didn't throw it, so it turned into sandlot stuff and scrambling around hoping a WR would get back to an open space - thankfully Bond bailed us out. The shovel pass was perhaps the best example. JM totally screwed up by not throwing the ball on time. Guys were OPEN, really OPEN for a long time, but he never throws the ball, but then he pulls off the highlight worthy shovel pass once the play is broken. Same play, same player, being horrible one second and a highlight the next second. Thing is we wouldn't need the highlight play if he could just execute what was designed, called, and executed correctly by out other 10 guys on the field.

NFL scouts watching Burtons film from 23 said (and posted on twitter/X) that film review was watching him run great routes and being open a lot, but not getting the ball thrown his way.

PFF stats are the same way - total paradox: 9.2% big time throw rating is top 5ish as is his passing grade on deep passes. That's great. For short to intermediate, he was rated all the way down at the 100th best - that's right, 99QBs ahead of him. PFF had him as holding the ball an FBS WORST 3.45 seconds (and it was NOT play design, per all the statements above - routes where there to be executed sooner). PFF has had his pressure-to-sack ratio as 32.4% which is the 6th WORST in FBS. All those things are awful.

A-Day game this year - going 3 for 9, and clearly not making the right throws/reads on a lot of plays. The first drive alone JM mis-executed several reads and that continued through the game leading to JMs very obvious frustration.

Net - complete paradox, where the ceiling could be high, but unfortunately, the floor is also exceptionally low. Complete busts on play execution, but then a highlight on the same play.

It's boom-or-bust. many people see the boom and that's it. Unfortunately, there's a lot of busts (more busts than booms), and the busts really limit the overall efficiency of the offense, as the boom isn't really that reliable, and a big reason why the booms are needed is due to the busts from the same dude.

Thems the facts. Real evidence that tells us what we already know. He likes to throw long cause that's what he's pretty good at. He's terrible throwing short routes - but we don't really know why? Is it because he doesn't see them? Is it because he doesn't have good touch or accuracy? And, the facts show us whatever he does he's real slow doing it!

I had noted the same on Palmer's video concerning the wide open "hot route" receiver. That's the throw he should have made. Wide open receiver who is going to make YAC but JM chooses the big, harder throw over the top. IN this case it worked out...but IMO it hurt Palmer's support of JM. How many more plays like that did we see all year long when a guy was wide open and JM chose a more difficult throw that was incomplete OR he just ate it with a sack???

As we get into fall camp, it's going to be interesting to see if what we saw in the A-Day game continues. Will JM struggle and TS continue to improve. It could get real interesting for JM if he's struggling to keep the starting role.

I think that's the danger in being made the face of the program the way the media continues to do. To be fair, it's not JM's doing; it's theirs (mostly, except the LANK stuff).

That's the thing I had mentioned about the extra-curricular stuff a while back. If JM loses the job it makes it much more "controversial" and personally embarrassing for him.

IMO - this is why I think he should personally just stay away from the photo ops. That doesn't mean he has to work on football 24/7 but that he should probably just stay behind the scenes more.

 

[AlexanderFan]

Well that's the great paradox of Milroe. Due to his physical tools, sometimes when he doesn't execute a play properly, he still makes something happen. The downside of that is that decent defenses can really limit his upside.

Case in point is the first play on the video Palmer uses. Milroe throws a pretty darn good ball for touchdown so that's a great play right?

Well, he had an obvious six man rush with only a six man protect, which meant an RB having to pass pro 1v1, so he should have known to be looking at a hot route instead of going deep. There was a hot route on the play to the TE, and it was WIDE OPEN. Palmer even mentions it. Milroe seems to be looking that way, but never throws the ball. For the record, Palmer is wrong about it being a bad snap at JMs ankles. The ball was placed well enough, just a hair to the right. JM muffed the catch and didn't collect it till it was almost on the ground. Even with that, there was still time to make the pass to 84. If that pass is made on time, the rush never gets close to pressuring him.

On the TD series I broke down (against AU or UGA - can't remember) where JM went 4-4, that was great right? Not really as it was the same thing where guys were open on schedule, but JM didn't throw it, so it turned into sandlot stuff and scrambling around hoping a WR would get back to an open space - thankfully Bond bailed us out. The shovel pass was perhaps the best example. JM totally screwed up by not throwing the ball on time. Guys were OPEN, really OPEN for a long time, but he never throws the ball, but then he pulls off the highlight worthy shovel pass once the play is broken. Same play, same player, being horrible one second and a highlight the next second. Thing is we wouldn't need the highlight play if he could just execute what was designed, called, and executed correctly by out other 10 guys on the field.

NFL scouts watching Burtons film from 23 said (and posted on twitter/X) that film review was watching him run great routes and being open a lot, but not getting the ball thrown his way.

PFF stats are the same way - total paradox: 9.2% big time throw rating is top 5ish as is his passing grade on deep passes. That's great. For short to intermediate, he was rated all the way down at the 100th best - that's right, 99QBs ahead of him. PFF had him as holding the ball an FBS WORST 3.45 seconds (and it was NOT play design, per all the statements above - routes where there to be executed sooner). PFF has had his pressure-to-sack ratio as 32.4% which is the 6th WORST in FBS. All those things are awful.

A-Day game this year - going 3 for 9, and clearly not making the right throws/reads on a lot of plays. The first drive alone JM mis-executed several reads and that continued through the game leading to JMs very obvious frustration.

Net - complete paradox, where the ceiling could be high, but unfortunately, the floor is also exceptionally low. Complete busts on play execution, but then a highlight on the same play.

It's boom-or-bust. many people see the boom and that's it. Unfortunately, there's a lot of busts (more busts than booms), and the busts really limit the overall efficiency of the offense, as the boom isn't really that reliable, and a big reason why the booms are needed is due to the busts from the same dude.

Another one:

 

[AlexanderFan]

If my timetable is correct we are about to swing back to questioning the qualifications of the people who are critical of Jalen, that means we are on lap two.

 

[81usaf92]

All the criticism of him doing this media thing or that and it all somehow relating back to him being a terrible QB...or to his most ardent detractors...not even a QB at all.

If he farted, some people would criticize the smell as proof he can't read a defense.

As for the film proving all his detractors correct, it would seem there is some debate about that even among people who are experts in the field.

IF it was an open and shut case that he's as awful as some say, why on earth would anyone in a position to decide even consider him as the starting QB?

Is it even possible that he's not as bad as some say...and not as good as other say?

Or is that not even debatable?

If he was great as some say then shouldn’t it be an open and shut case as well? Tua and Bryce were both coming off losses in NCG and very few questioned them. Hell Mac got some of the worst criticism I’ve seen on this board because of his Arkansas game and the talent level of the quarterbacks behind him… but his play in the first 3-4 games shut his critics up. At some point you have to admit that the prevailing criticism exists because there is a legitimate amount of reasons to doubt Milroe is the next great quarterback for Alabama and that possibly the guys behind him could do better.

The point being is that the Alabama fanbase is divided on Milroe because Milroe hasn’t done enough to prove he is the guy that can take us where Alabama wants to be.

 

[AlexanderFan]

If he was great as some say then shouldn’t it be an open and shut case as well? Tua and Bryce were both coming off losses in NCG and very few questioned them. Hell Mac got some of the worst criticism I’ve seen on this board because of his Arkansas game and the talent level of the quarterbacks behind him… but his play in the first 3-4 games shut his critics up. At some point you have to admit that the prevailing criticism exists because there is a legitimate amount of reasons to doubt Milroe is the next great quarterback for Alabama and that possibly the guys behind him could do better.

The point being is that the Alabama fanbase is divided on Milroe because Milroe hasn’t done enough to prove he is the guy that can take us where Alabama wants to be.

This sums up where I’m at.

I feel if he were limited in arm strength but made up for it by dissecting defenses with accurate on time short passes I would feel better about it. The long ball gets shut down too easily and the offense stagnates.

 

[BamaMoon]

If he was great as some say then shouldn’t it be an open and shut case as well? Tua and Bryce were both coming off losses in NCG and very few questioned them. Hell Mac got some of the worst criticism I’ve seen on this board because of his Arkansas game and the talent level of the quarterbacks behind him… but his play in the first 3-4 games shut his critics up. At some point you have to admit that the prevailing criticism exists because there is a legitimate amount of reasons to doubt Milroe is the next great quarterback for Alabama and that possibly the guys behind him could do better.

The point being is that the Alabama fanbase is divided on Milroe because Milroe hasn’t done enough to prove he is the guy that can take us where Alabama wants to be.

Such a great point. A QB who has won the support of the fanbase like Tua, Bryce and Mack or going back AJ or even McElroy would never be discussed like this.

We have a full year of him starting (and a couple of games from '22 also) to know "who he is."

It's really amazing this is still debatable.

 

[davefrat]

Such a great point. A QB who has won the support of the fanbase like Tua, Bryce and Mack or going back AJ or even McElroy would never be discussed like this.

We have a full year of him starting (and a couple of games from '22 also) to know "who he is."

It's really amazing this is still debatable.

Seems to me that the debate lies somewhere between "He's not a real QB" and "He's gonna win the Heisman."

 

[davefrat]

If he was great as some say then shouldn’t it be an open and shut case as well? Tua and Bryce were both coming off losses in NCG and very few questioned them. Hell Mac got some of the worst criticism I’ve seen on this board because of his Arkansas game and the talent level of the quarterbacks behind him… but his play in the first 3-4 games shut his critics up. At some point you have to admit that the prevailing criticism exists because there is a legitimate amount of reasons to doubt Milroe is the next great quarterback for Alabama and that possibly the guys behind him could do better.

The point being is that the Alabama fanbase is divided on Milroe because Milroe hasn’t done enough to prove he is the guy that can take us where Alabama wants to be.

Yes, were that the case it would be open and shut.

Seems like there are plenty who have decided that he is either horrendously bad or incredibly good, with nothing possible in-between.

It's also possible that we don't have anyone on the roster who can take us to where we want to be.

IF that's the case, then the discussion is really about who can take us the farthest with their limitations.

 

[AlexanderFan]

Yes, were that the case it would be open and shut.

Seems like there are plenty who have decided that he is either horrendously bad or incredibly good, with nothing possible in-between.

It's also possible that we don't have anyone on the roster who can take us to where we want to be.

IF that's the case, then the discussion is really about who can take us the farthest with their limitations.

I think some of it can also be that we’ve been down this road with Hurts, and when his tendencies were defended Alabama struggled offensively a great bit afterwards. That’s not to say there’s a guaranteed Tua on the depth chart, but I do think people want to see if the other quarterbacks would grow with that experience of playing a lot more.

 

[davefrat]

I think some of it can also be that we’ve been down this road with Hurts, and when his tendencies were defended Alabama struggled offensively a great bit afterwards. That’s not to say there’s a guaranteed Tua on the depth chart, but I do think people want to see if the other quarterbacks would grow with that experience of playing a lot more.

I trust that DeBoer and his staff know what they're doing and that they will pick the player they see best fits the position...and that they will have the fortitude to make a change in the event that is necessary during the season.

That's why he's getting paid more for one year of work than I'd get paid in nearly 100 years at my current job.

 

[Bamabuzzard]

I think some of it can also be that we’ve been down this road with Hurts, and when his tendencies were defended Alabama struggled offensively a great bit afterwards. That’s not to say there’s a guaranteed Tua on the depth chart, but I do think people want to see if the other quarterbacks would grow with that experience of playing a lot more.

I'll never forget the game in which the blue print was cast to defend Hurts. It was the LSU game in Baton Rouge when their DC made it a point to have both DE's seal the edges, force him to stay in the pocket and go through his progressions. From that game on, every decent SEC team we played did that and our offensive production started to dip.

 

[Cruloc]

Seems to me that the debate lies somewhere between "He's not a real QB" and "He's gonna win the Heisman."

That seems like it could be applied to every single player at the QB spot.....since 1935.

 

[davefrat]

That seems like it could be applied to every single player at the QB spot.....since 1935.

I assume you're being facetious even though your post isn't in blue.

I highly doubt anyone anywhere (including himself and his family) ever believed that the likes of Spencer Pennington was going to win anything as a QB at Bama.

And I'm very confident that no one ever even thought to themselves that Tua wasn't a real QB, much less utter such a thought in public.

 

[davefrat]

I'll never forget the game in which the blue print was cast to defend Hurts. It was the LSU game in Baton Rouge when their DC made it a point to have both DE's seal the edges, force him to stay in the pocket and go through his progressions. From that game on, every decent SEC team we played did that and our offensive production started to dip.

Hurts certainly had his limitations.

That being said, I don't recall anyone ever accusing him of not being a real QB? Maybe they did. I recall a fair amount of grousing about him.

I wonder where Milroe is at this point in comparison to Hurts at that point.

I know that Milroe is quite a bit older than Hurts was when they both became the starter.

 

[Cruloc]

I assume you're being facetious even though your post isn't in blue.

I highly doubt anyone anywhere (including himself and his family) ever believed that the likes of Spencer Pennington was going to win anything as a QB at Bama.

And I'm very confident that no one ever even thought to themselves that Tua wasn't a real QB, much less utter such a thought in public.

Not at all. You stated the debate on Milroe specifically was somewhere between he's not a QB and he's going to win the Heisman. I stated that you could apply that generalization to every player that ever played QB since 1935.....I didn't state where Tua was on that debate scale or Spencer Pennington.

Pennington would have been closer to the he's not a QB side.
Tua obviously would have been closer to the he's gonna win a Heisman.
Bryce won the Heisman.
Mac almost won the Heisman.

Milroe is closer to the he's not a QB.....but some will say he's close to he's gonna win a Heisman because he was in the voting last year. (he wasn't in the voting because of his grasp of an offense or his ability to read a defense.)

 

[Bamabuzzard]

Hurts certainly had his limitations.

That being said, I don't recall anyone ever accusing him of not being a real QB? Maybe they did. I recall a fair amount of grousing about him.

I wonder where Milroe is at this point in comparison to Hurts at that point.

I know that Milroe is quite a bit older than Hurts was when they both became the starter.

Well, if you don't call "He'll never play quarterback in the NFL" an accusation of him not being a real quarterback then no. But he got a lot of criticism and yes, it was suggested he change positions. It was said that "he couldn't read defenses" which was true. He was a one-read pony until he left Alabama and started working with Lincoln Riley at Oklahoma. But Hurts got a lot of criticism when he was here.

 

[Cruloc]

Well, if you don't call "He'll never play quarterback in the NFL" an accusation of him not being a real quarterback then no. But he got a lot of criticism and yes, it was suggested he change positions. It was said that "he couldn't read defenses" which was true. He was a one-read pony until he left Alabama and started working with Lincoln Riley at Oklahoma. But Hurts got a lot of criticism when he was here.

And the best the thing that ever happened to him....and arguably what has made him an NFL QB....was sitting a year behind Tua, learning and then getting coached by Riley. Without those two things happening, I doubt he makes it as an NFL QB.