Russia Invades Ukraine VII

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Tidewater

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I heard a discussion this morning on tv, it was suggested Ukraine needed weapons to go after the Russian Navy. I wonder what it would take? Could drones get the job done?

As far as supporting Ukraine, I’d like to see us go ”all-in” and overwhelm Russia with weaponry.
I am in Eastern Europe and do not have access to English-language media, but I'd wager they mean anti-ship missiles. Very specific and complicated pieces of kit. The Taiwanese have built a bunch and the most advanced are supersonic.
 

Tidewater

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I am in Eastern Europe and do not have access to English-language media, but I'd wager they mean anti-ship missiles. Very specific and complicated pieces of kit. The Taiwanese have built a bunch and the most advanced are supersonic.
The Japanese had the right idea. Attack the troop ships, not the battleships. The horrifying Japanese spin was that their anti ship missiles were manned.
Still the idea works. You do not attack the hardened defenses. You attack the unhardened logistics/transport ships.
 
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TIDE-HSV

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The Japanese had the right idea. Attack the troop ships, but the battleships. The horrifying Japanese spin was that their anti ship missiles were manned.
Still the idea works. You do not attack the hardened defenses. You attack the unhardened logistics/transport ships.
I think you may be typing on a phone. :) Or even attack the civilian population and attempt to demoralize them. Didn't work on London or the Germans. IDK to what extent it worked in Georgia and Chechenya...
 
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Blueguitar

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Russia is the 'favorite' that is severely behind at halftime. The 'smart' money may still be on Russia.
They are way behind, and there aren't a lot of paths for them to catch up. One would be to just grind Ukraine down in a very long war. The problem with that is that Russia may not be able to sustain such a war economically, especially if the West continues to supply the Ukraine military, and Russian military morale already seems to be terrible and could entirely collapse in a long war.

The only other path I can see for Russia to "catch up" is terrifying to contemplate -- the use of chemical weapons, bioweapons or tactical nukes. That would certainly change the game. It would probably mean an even worse outcome for Russia -- probable NATO intervention, possible retaliation in kind against Russia, and a weakened Russia being an even bigger international pariah for even longer. But I worry that a desperate and delusional Putin might not see it that way.
 
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JDCrimson

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I'm seeing a few headlines where we are letting the public know the types of equipment we are sharing with Ukraine. I think this is by design. Do they want to see what Putin does when the US publicly admitting arms support for Ukraine?
 

92tide

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I'm seeing a few headlines where we are letting the public know the types of equipment we are sharing with Ukraine. I think this is by design. Do they want to see what Putin does when the US publicly admitting arms support for Ukraine?
it seems like all along we have been using released information to get in putin's head. i think that is part of what was going on in the run up when biden and his team were raising alarms for a few weeks prior.
 

JDCrimson

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I think NATO is openly sharing this information to bait him into an escalation they get involved in.

it seems like all along we have been using released information to get in putin's head. i think that is part of what was going on in the run up when biden and his team were raising alarms for a few weeks prior.
 
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The budget spent on the military in the U.S. dwarfs that of Russia. With Russia exposed and looking hapless, and committing war crimes, it’s time to flex our budget by flooding the zone with whatever weaponry we have that would be helpful. We have a willing proxy doing much better than expected In fighting.

It doesn’t make sense to let Putin have any kind of victory because he might react badly to a loss. That’s just international blackmail. Hard decisions.
 

TIDE-HSV

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The budget spent on the military in the U.S. dwarfs that of Russia. With Russia exposed and looking hapless, and committing war crimes, it’s time to flex our budget by flooding the zone with whatever weaponry we have that would be helpful. We have a willing proxy doing much better than expected In fighting.

It doesn’t make sense to let Putin have any kind of victory because he might react badly to a loss. That’s just international blackmail. Hard decisions.
One of the complaints of the Ukrainian delegation which came to DC was that, if we'd started training them on our weapons 43 days ago, they'd be up to speed now. I take that with a grain of salt. That may have been true of light anti-tank weapons, but it's sure as hell not true of an F-35, nor even an Abrams, which requires almost six months, not to mention maintaining these heavy weapons. However, some of the nations bordering Ukraine have offered to give them Soviet-era weapons which they do know how to operate. We're holding back and slow-walking all but light defensive weapons. IDK why, but, if it's still trying to tiptoe around Putain, it's time for it to stop...
 

Tidewater

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Given this, the idea of the attack toward Kyiv as a feint is plausible
I really do not think so. I believe that it was the main effort, but ran into a tractor-equipped buzzsaw called Ukraine.
You do not commit so much of scarce resources (manpower, tanks, etc.) to a feint as the Russians did to the Kyiv pincer.
I still think Putin's entourage told the Boss what the Boss wanted to hear and the Boss was too stupid to check their math.
 
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