Tell me about Washington

[crimsonaudio]

I don't think you understood my post. I will try and restate it. Last time I looked nearly 50% of the entire staffs of the recruiting sites are covering just Florida and Georgia, your charts show how skewed that is. Its pretty hard if not impossible to consistently be ranked high these days if you don't recruit Florida and Georgia.

So, assuming the recruiting rankings are so skewed, how to you explain how those who consistently recruit well (according to these services) being the teams that win most often?

 

[NationalTitles18]

I don't think you understood my post. I will try and restate it. Last time I looked nearly 50% of the entire staffs of the recruiting sites are covering just Florida and Georgia, your charts show how skewed that is. Its pretty hard if not impossible to consistently be ranked high these days if you don't recruit Florida and Georgia.

I've never really plunged that in-depth, but I'm willing to bet CA gets covered as well as TX. I can also say that HS football is a different animal down South in regards to public and media attention. (compared to CA) Assuming 50% is truth, playing to your market may be advantageous monetarily. Regardless, the South has a higher density of talent that generally goes against higher caliber competition in HS, which can make evaluation "easier". And it's relatively easy to get to the games compared to, say, the Northwest.

PS: and to evaluate multiple talents at the same venue, therefore getting you more bang for the buck.

 

[TiderJack]

I don't think you understood my post. I will try and restate it. Last time I looked nearly 50% of the entire staffs of the recruiting sites are covering just Florida and Georgia, your charts show how skewed that is. Its pretty hard if not impossible to consistently be ranked high these days if you don't recruit Florida and Georgia.

I clearly understood your post.

The "nearly 50% of entire staffs cover just FLA and GA" can not be accurate. Can you back up that statement?

The charts and link I posted does not show that the recruiting sites are skewed. It shows that most of the football talent is in FLA, GA and the southeast and that the recruiting services are accurately evaluating talent.

Your last sentence is somewhat accurate but I don't see how this correlates with the recruiting sites being skewed.

 

[Bamabuzzard]

So, assuming the recruiting rankings are so skewed, how to you explain how those who consistently recruit well (according to these services) being the teams that win most often?

Scheduling. The PAC 12 plays more conference games. They beat each other up.

 

[uafanataum]

The best college in football recruits both sec and pac12 areas. Easy solution: if you want to be as good as Bama then recruit all over.

 

[NationalTitles18]

So, assuming the recruiting rankings are so skewed, how to you explain how those who consistently recruit well (according to these services) being the teams that win most often?

Eastern Poll Bias and 8 game conference schedules.

 

[Marshawn24]

So, assuming the recruiting rankings are so skewed, how to you explain how those who consistently recruit well (according to these services) being the teams that win most often?

but they really don't.

Top 10 win% the last 10 years
Bama
Ohio St
Boise St
Oklahoma
Oregon
LSU
Florida St
TCU
Clemson
Wisconsin

Wisconsin TCU Boise and Oregon have never been ranked top 10 in recruiting rankings, Oklahoma and Clemson average is below the top 10. USC Florida Auburn Georgia Notre Dame consistently ranked top 10.

 

[SoDawg]

L

Browning threw a record 10 touchdown passes in his very first varsity game as a sophomore. The fact that he wasn't a "5 star" recruit is why I don't take rankings seriously. Browning went to only 1 camp during his entire high school career(Boise St as a junior)

You realize Browning had an offer from Alabama....yes? http://www.espn.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/180839/jake-browning

He didn't go to camps because he is the anti-thesis of the camp circuit, attention. He threw, I think 7 TD's in the CA Championship game...

"Browning attended Folsom High School in Folsom, California. Browning set numerous national and state records during his high school career. In 46 games, he completed 1,191 of 1,708 attempts for 16,775 yards and 229 touchdowns, all California records. The 229 touchdowns also broke the national record previously held by Maty Mauk who had 219.[3][4] As a senior he threw for a national record 91 touchdown passes. He also passed for a California record 5,790 yards, which broke his record from his junior year. Browning was the Gatorade Football Player of the Year his junior and senior year. Browning was rated as a four-star recruit by Scout and Rivals.com and was ranked as the third best pro-style recruit in his class. He committed to the University of Washington to play college football"

http://www.maxpreps.com/athlete/jake-browning/aOpIlfTlEeKZ5AAmVebBJg/gendersport/football-stats.htm

http://www.thenewstribune.com/sports/high-school/article26250742.html

 

[centerstar]

Unsure if this is the thread to post but: Espn analyst saying this year has a record high of 20+ yard plays in Nick Saban era.

Have heard it but it's not true. Last year was worse for long gainers against us.

http://www.cfbstats.com/2015/team/8/rushing/defense/situational.html
http://www.cfbstats.com/2015/team/8/passing/defense/situational.html

 

[TiderJack]

but they really don't.

Top 10 win% the last 10 years
Bama
Ohio St
Boise St
Oklahoma
Oregon
LSU
Florida St
TCU
Clemson
Wisconsin

Wisconsin TCU Boise and Oregon have never been ranked top 10 in recruiting rankings, Oklahoma and Clemson average is below the top 10. USC Florida Auburn Georgia Notre Dame consistently ranked top 10.

Let's breakdown some of those top 10 in win %

Boise St. - do I really need to even say anything
Oregon - developed a fast offense nobody had seen, had one special player, see 2016 Oregon for current state of the program
TCU - has been in the Big 12 for 1/2 that time and had one good season, was in another inferior league for the other half where they domintated

The rest of the top 10 you list are big time players in recruiting except for Wisconsin.

For the others you list in the SEC being ranked in the top 10 recruiting, you can be in the top 10 in national recruiting but be 5th or 6th in the conference. I know you are not used to this but it is a grind every week in the SEC.

 

[JustinT256]

I respect Washington football and their fans. But you guys have brought some unusual debates to this forum.

 

[SoDawg]

The problem with Browning doesn't have anything to do with his arm strength or ability to throw the ball. His problem is his lack of mobility. He will not be able to just sit back in the pocket and survey the field. That's the biggest reason why I don't give Washington much of a chance to win the game. You need a QB like Watson or a great oline just to give your offense a chance to score. If Washington had an elite offensive line I think the outcome of this game would be much closer.

I know that a Washington fan will bring up Chad Kelly or Austin Allen throwing for 400+ yards. Kelly has freakish arm talent plus he's a good enough athlete to hurt a defense with his legs. The Arkansas game was something like 42-17 and Bama just checked out of the game mentally at that point.

I've also been reading a lot about John Ross and what he might be able to do in this game. He's a good player but I can't remember the last time a 5"10 WR really gave the Bama defense a problem. Our secondary has traditionally struggled against the bigger WRs (~6'4) such as Mike Evans, Laquan Treadwell, Evan Engram, Sammie Coates, Duke Williams etc. I don't care how fast Ross is I don't see him doing a lot of damage at his stature..

Agree, Browning is not a dual-threat RB/QB type player. He is an execute RP0, read defense, go threw progressions, timing, accuracy, type QB -- think Kellen Moore from Boise St. Second, I agree that our OL is the challenge. They are talented, but young so I don't think they can physically match up against your front 7. Having said that, the Chris Peterson offense is about formation/motion/leverage..and causing the problems for the Defense to get properly aligned. This gives us a punchers chance imho.

On Ross, he is not a big, physical WR, but is pretty fast and good technician/good hands. He worked with Deshaun Foster over summer on routes, using his speed...lots of sand work running routes...

 

[SoDawg]

So we've gone from telling us how many NFL players they have on their roster to how the recruiting services are biased, otherwise they would have more 5*s on their team?

What's next?

Compare the Scout rankings vs ESPN and you can see the disparity. ESPN and many services are EAST coast focused, Scout tends to have better West Coast guys (Greg Biggins formerly of ESPN). Just like the games, there is just less exposure/coverage from those guys on the West Coast...not 'evil', just less exposure/understanding.

Whoever rates them, UW needs more 5 Star guys

 

[NationalTitles18]

but they really don't.

Top 10 win% the last 10 years
Bama
Ohio St
Boise St
Oklahoma
Oregon
LSU
Florida St
TCU
Clemson
Wisconsin

Wisconsin TCU Boise and Oregon have never been ranked top 10 in recruiting rankings, Oklahoma and Clemson average is below the top 10. USC Florida Auburn Georgia Notre Dame consistently ranked top 10.

Interesting article from article a couple of years ago disputes your conclusion.

http://www.footballstudyhall.com/20...-matters-why-the-sites-get-the-rankings-right

To describe those results as "compelling" would be selling them short. It's a landslide. On the final count, the higher-ranked team according to the recruiting rankings won roughly two-thirds of the time, and every "class" as a whole had a winning record against every class ranked below it every single year. (The only exception came last year, when "three-star" teams came up short in head-to-head meetings with "one-star" teams. Otherwise, the hierarchy held across every line.) The gap on the field also widened with the gap in the recruiting scores: While "one-star" recruiting teams fared slightly better against blue-chip opponents than "two-star" teams, both groups combined managed a grand total of 19 wins over "five-star" opponents in 112 tries. Broadly speaking, the final results on the field broke along a straight line demarcated on signing day.

Do you still have to keep them in school and develop them? Of course! Do some schools with good coaches perform better than expected while some schools with bad coaches perform worse? You bet! Recruiting well does not guarantee success (much like money can't buy happiness), but it sure doesn't hurt.

 

[crimsonaudio]

but they really don't..

They really do - the measure of w winner is championships, at least in our part of the world. Bus, TCU, Oregon, and Wisconsin haven't won a NC, so I don't care how many games they win per year.

Here's a hint: Bama, OSU, OU, LSU, FSU all recently won NCs. All of them recruit extremely well.

In fact, here are the teams that have won NCs over the last 10 years: Alabama, OSU, FSU, LSU, Florida, Auburn. All of them recruit well, generally at or near the top10 every year. It's not a coincidence.

 

[NationalTitles18]

They really do - the measure of w winner is championships, at least in our part of the world. Bus, TCU, Oregon, and Wisconsin haven't won a NC, so I don't care how many games they win per year.

Here's a hint: Bama, OSU, OU, LSU, FSU all recently won NCs. All of them recruit extremely well.

In fact, here are the teams that have won NCs over the last 10 years: Alabama, OSU, FSU, LSU, Florida, Auburn. All of them recruit well, generally at or near the top10 every year. It's not a coincidence.

A certain writer I refuse to name wrote an article a while back showing that relationship to the championships, but I'm not going to give him a link or a direct mention. Marshawn24 is just flat out wrong if he believes otherwise. We don't call Oregon the Zero's for nothing (not directly pertinent, but it is related and maybe one area where we can find consensus).

 

[BadgerTidefan]

So you agree it is advantageous to play only 8 conference games? That has been my point... You believe 8 Conference Games in SEC is tougher than 9 in Pac12 or BiG and playing 9 would hurt your chances to play in CFB Playoffs it sounds like.

So suppose as a Pac12 Fan, I believe it is harder to play 7 Conference Games in Pac12 than 8 in SEC...so we go to 7 Game Conference Schedule and then 4 week OOC games and 1 P5 OOC game... say against Vanderbuilt, Missou, Kentucky, etc.

Would that be fair then?

Every division is going to have a bias... .I do and you do, about your 'conference', so isn't the only way to make it as equitable as possible is to have a uniform standard?

I read Tidefans every day, but only post from time to time That said, the back and forth about 8 game conference schedule vs 9 game schedule is getting way overdone and boring. The SEC has played 8 games for quite some time, way before there was a 4 team playoff, it's obvious that the SEC isn't trying to gain some type of advantage. It's neither an advantage or a disadvantage. It's also obvious, at least to me that the committee doesn't care, strength of schedule trumps the conference preference for 8 or 9 games. It's pretty understandable that the SOS measures all the games no matter who or what conference. The conferences are all different and each team within each conference is different so SOS is the true measure.

 

[B1GTide]

The reality is that these guys are looking for data points that align with their world view. You really can't convince them that their world view is all wrong, and evidence that refutes that world view is wasted on them.

I would just stick to Xs and Os. Clearly their Jimmies and Joes are world class.

 

[NationalTitles18]

The reality is that these guys are looking for data points that align with their world view. You really can't convince them that their world view is all wrong, and evidence that refutes that world view is wasted on them.

I would just stick to Xs and Os. Clearly their Jimmies and Joes are world class.

 

[CrimsonForce]

Chris Peterson on Alabama: