DeBoer and recruiting

[bamaga]

Feeling nervous about his ability to recruit. I knew coming in he didn’t had a great track record.

Reading comments like “he bounces from place to place before he poor / lack of recruiting catches up to him”

I’m sure this was brought up in the interview and I’m sure he said the right thing. I’m sure Saban has talked to him.

I expect maybe his first season to be our worst class since Saban took over (yes I know there are a few recruits there now) but maybe it will get better?

How do y’all feel about it? Especially with Georgia being the new “Alabama” in recruiting

He bounces place to place before poor recruiting catches up to him. Or maybe he moves around faster than he can establish relationships, and a foothold in his new recruiting territory. I too questioned his recruiting, but also realized I don’t really know if he can or can not. Definitely has ground to make up in the Southeast, but the Alabama name sells better in living rooms than Washington. All we can say is , we will see.

 

[CoolBreeze]

Dude has Nick as a mentor and he wants to be successful. Saban knows the lifeblood of a program are the players. I think we will be fine but there will be a dip in recruiting, at least initially.

 

[B1GTide]

Since Saban is staying actively involved in the support of the program, DeBoer will be fine. He needs to be able to sell his coaches. On offense, that won't be a problem. Now he needs to make great defensive hires, because these kids want to play on Sundays.

To get back to the Saban factor - he will introduce DeBoer to every HS coach personally. That is the kind of jump start that he never got anywhere else. His association with Saban will create a dynamic that he has never had before. Add the Alabama brand and he is going to be able to recruit at a very high level. Saban level? No. Saban is the best recruiter ever. But he just needs to be as good as Kirby. With Saban's help, I think he can get there.

 

[CoolBreeze]

Since Saban is staying actively involved in the support of the program, DeBoer will be fine. He needs to be able to sell his coaches. On offense, that won't be a problem. Now he needs to make great defensive hires, because these kids want to play on Sundays.

To get back to the Saban factor - he will introduce DeBoer to every HS coach personally. That is the kind of jump start that he never got anywhere else. His association with Saban will create a dynamic that he has never had before. Add the Alabama brand and he is going to be able to recruit at a very high level. Saban level? No. Saban is the best recruiter ever. But he just needs to be as good as Kirby. With Saban's help, I think he can get there.

What we have learned from Saban is that recruiting is a 365 day a year deal. We are recruiting players in the 9th and 10th grade. It takes a 14 hour a day schedule to do what Nick has done so we shall see if Kalen is up to the task.

 

[GboyBama]

Since Saban is staying actively involved in the support of the program, DeBoer will be fine. He needs to be able to sell his coaches. On offense, that won't be a problem. Now he needs to make great defensive hires, because these kids want to play on Sundays.

To get back to the Saban factor - he will introduce DeBoer to every HS coach personally. That is the kind of jump start that he never got anywhere else. His association with Saban will create a dynamic that he has never had before. Add the Alabama brand and he is going to be able to recruit at a very high level. Saban level? No. Saban is the best recruiter ever. But he just needs to be as good as Kirby. With Saban's help, I think he can get there.

That sounds like a great plan, assuming it all comes together.

 

[B1GTide]

That sounds like a great plan, assuming it all comes together.

Change is hard. At this point all we can do as fans is remain positive and supportive.

 

[KrAzY3]

If he doesn’t recruit, he will be replaced. Life continues either way

In this NIL era, I'm not sure it has to be that black and white. If he has enough funding, his ability to recruit might not matter. That's part of why I'm raising this concern, we're now in a period of time where checks can bring in talent without the NCAA knocking on your door. Money can make up for sub-par recruiting in a way it might that would have been more difficult than in the past.

Also, success in the SEC will make DoBoer a better recruiter by itself. So the vital period in terms of recruiting/keeping players is going to be the next couple of years. He wins an SEC title, goes to the playoff, has some measure of success, he's going to become a better recruiter. But, hopefully he can be bought (literally) some time. Now is the time to open checkbooks...

Finally, a question, why has Lane done more with less, but this guy just can’t recruit? What’s the difference? 4-8 to the College championship in two years is remarkable no matter how you slice it.

I doubt there's a better Xs and Ox coach than DoBoer that was readily available to Alabama. I do not question him at all in that regard, and I have no reason to.

I just hope he has the talent available to succeed, and finessing your way through the now increasingly brutal SEC is probably not possible. If he has the talent, I believe he can win though. I just hope Alabama and not just the athletic department, but boosters and so on, are able to be more proactive and not reactive to that situation.

Edit: I guess the Bond situation underscores the entire issue, here's the quote from Bond
" Bond said that new Alabama coach Kalen DeBoer reached out and that he didn't get back to him. Bond said that Sarkisian recruited him hard to Texas out of high school and they regained that connection quickly this weekend. He said Sarkisian, who is Texas' offensive playcaller, is one of the best offensive minds in college football. "

Milroe issues aside, Texas was able and willing to throw money at him, and he had a relationship with Sarkisian but none with DeBoer. This could play out over and over unless some things are done to make DeBoer's "offer" more appealing, at least until he's had a chance to develop those relationships.

 

[BearFoot]

A couple of thoughts:

The underlying theme that many don’t seem to appreciate, is that he has done “more with less” at every stop he’s made. He beat Sark/Texas twice…he beat Lanning/Oregon twice. This bodes well for the possibilities here at The Capstone.

We sure like to remember Bryant saying, “I can take mine and beat your’n…and I’ll take your’n and beat mine”…or something to that effect. Sounds to me like that’s what CKD can do.

Also, If the movement between schools has been the purposeful attempt to position himself at the highest level possible…then he’s now here. Remember, Coach Saban did the same thing also, until he reached Alabama.

Most important of all….I can’t remember any transition between coaching staffs at any school, ever, where the outgoing coach passed the baton to the incoming coach…and then spent the time to help acclimate him to the intricacies of that role. To have the support of Coach Saban through this transition is going to be “IMMEASURABLE”

 

[CoolBreeze]

A couple of thoughts:

The underlying theme that many don’t seem to appreciate, is that he has done “more with less” at every stop he’s made. He beat Sark/Texas twice…he beat Lanning/Oregon twice. This bodes well for the possibilities here at The Capstone.

We sure like to remember Bryant saying, “I can take mine and beat your’n…and I’ll take your’n and beat mine”…or something to that effect. Sounds to me like that’s what CKD can do.

Also, If the movement between schools has been the purposeful attempt to position himself at the highest level possible…then he’s now here. Remember, Coach Saban did the same thing also, until he reached Alabama.

Most important of all….I can’t remember any transition between coaching staffs at any school, ever, where the outgoing coach passed the baton to the incoming coach…and then spent the time to help acclimate him to the intricacies of that role. To have the support of Coach Saban through this transition is going to be “IMMEASURABLE”

Really nice post.

 

[STONECOLDSABAN]

Yes. Where Curry is concerned, I was more indicating what our team's personalty was under him. Good enough to rack up offensive stats and win a good bit, but shaky where it came to a bloody bar brawl.

Also, at no point did I say I wasn't giving CKD "a chance." I fact, I mentioned that there are a lot of good points out there about the guy.

If it makes you feel better GMAC was talking about how Mentally tough Dabeor's teams seem to be. He is 7-0 Against Lanning, Riley, and Sark combined. I think he is like 12-2 against ranked teams. (need to double check that one).

 

[KrAzY3]

We sure like to remember Bryant saying, “I can take mine and beat your’n…and I’ll take your’n and beat mine”…or something to that effect. Sounds to me like that’s what CKD can do.

It has limits though. DeBoer had 9 6 year Covid seniors. He did actually have one five star on the team, obviously none of these are guys he developed relationships as teenagers and developed out of high school.

One reason I predicted he was leaving Washington one way or the other (NFL or 'Bama) is he was due for a tough season in Washington with loss of talent (Penix, Odunze, etc...) and an incoming recruiting class that was pretty weak (30 something). Not only that, but he didn't just have USC and Oregon on the schedule next year, but Penn State and Michigan, so loss of talent, tougher schedule. Good time to leave...

It's one thing to point to his obvious success, it's another thing to understand what he did at Washington. They had two good recruiting classes before he showed up, he took those guys, he took some smart portal additions on his part (like Penix) and he did a really great job of cobbling that talent together. He's a win now hire, but the infrastructure was not in place to sustain that. His talent at Washington was going down, not up.

If success is to be sustained at Alabama, then that NIL money needs to come rolling in...

 

[BearFoot]

If success is to be sustained at Alabama, then that NIL money needs to come rolling in...

This would be a great positive approach to support the team. A little “therapeutic-skin-in-the-game” might help some posters reign-in the negativity in their view of the situation.

 

[KrAzY3]

This would be a great positive approach to support the team. A little “therapeutic-skin-in-the-game” might help some posters reign-in the negativity in their view of the situation.

I just want to be as clear as I possibly could about this. I want DeBoer to succeed, and I want him to have all the financial support possible.I saw on Reddit some people saying players are being offered 6 figures to leave and responses like "let them leave". No! Don't.

DeBoer seems like a great coach, but I don't want to test what level of talent he needs to succeed with. Just give him all the talent, heh!

Final point, the way NIL works now, it isn't just all boosters writing huge checks. Heck as a stocking stuffer my wife got me some cards (got a Justice Haynes autograph) and she was like "some of the money goes to the players". So even small purchases can help the cause.

 

[CrimsonTitles]

He bounces place to place before poor recruiting catches up to him. Or maybe he moves around faster than he can establish relationships, and a foothold in his new recruiting territory. I too questioned his recruiting, but also realized I don’t really know if he can or can not. Definitely has ground to make up in the Southeast, but the Alabama name sells better in living rooms than Washington. All we can say is , we will see.

Or maybe because the right opportunity came along. It's not like he's out there making lateral moves left and right. Every move he's made has been a promotion. Besides, he's only done it twice, not counting the jump from NAIA to FCS coordinator.That's kind of a bold assumption to make.

 

[BearFoot]

I just want to be as clear as I possibly could about this. I want DeBoer to succeed, and I want him to have all the financial support possible.I saw on Reddit some people saying players are being offered 6 figures to leave and responses like "let them leave". No! Don't.

DeBoer seems like a great coach, but I don't want to test what level of talent he needs to succeed with. Just give him all the talent, heh!

Final point, the way NIL works now, it isn't just all boosters writing huge checks. Heck as a stocking stuffer my wife got me some cards (got a Justice Haynes autograph) and she was like "some of the money goes to the players". So even small purchases can help the cause.

I’ve been around here long enough to appreciate you and your opinions…noting that you are quite thoughtful (as well as thorough) in your line of thinking.

We all deal with grief in our own ways, and we’re all dealing with the grief associated with the loss of a respected and beloved coach, as well as the fear associated with not knowing how this will affect the football program as we’ve come to know it.

I believe we made the very best choice from the available pool of “elite candidates” (Kirby was never leaving Georgia…Sark was never leaving Texas…Kiffin would have us on probation within 5 years…Dabo would have splintered the fan base, as well as Dabo’ing the opportunity…and Lanning, in my opinion, was nothing more than a comfort-blanky for those who wanted to feel a connection to the next coach)

Deboer was the best coach available from that elite pool of candidates, in my humble opinion, who would actually leave their current situation. Expecting Kirby or Sark to come here was as silly as other schools expecting Saban to leave Alabama…even though his name was at the top of every list.

 

[TheRealPokeChop]

Winning is recruiting.

Putting guys in the league is recruiting.

He can win, and he's about to have a 1st round WR and possible first round qb in this draft.

If he can hire the right staff (at least one Ace recruiter) keep the roster as intact as he can....and win this fall. Our program will sell. Itself.

Hes going to need more support that Saban and staff required in NIL. The money is there but has to be restrategized how aggressive we are with recruits and the portal. Saban got away without being aggressive. Deboer can't, not right now anyway. Far too many wolves at the door.

As a counter to how bad a recruiter he is id offer that he recruited Penix to indiana and coached him before he left for Fresno st. In fact he beat out Tennesee and Jeremy Pruitt McDonald's bags of cash for him.

When he got the UW job Penix followed him...and he developed him well.

In the short term get staff that know the area and can keep the relationships we have, over support him in the NIL space (this includes you if you are able, go join YEA Alabama) and give him time to win and establish himself here. 1

 

[Bamabuzzard]

I could quote more, everything else he said was accurate and complimentary. This was not sour grapes.

I'd already done my own research showing how Washington recruiting had taken a nose dive under DoBoer. This isn't speculation, just fact. He had like the 36th ranked class this year, despite all his success. He had over three years, 16 four stars.

I think it was 2019 and 2020 Washington had a class ranked 15th and 16th and in one class 16 four stars, so his predecessor did not have the same issues with recruiting. This isn't bias, this isn't any of that, it's stuff I pointed out before DoBoer was hired, a Washington poster just filled in the blanks a bit (missing on all the talent in-state).

The issue I have with this, is some people are pretending it's not a problem or concern. Obviously it is. Can it be fixed? Yes, but you can't fix a problem you pretend isn't there. In this case, due to NIL fans actually have a more proactive role now. There will need to be a warchest for DoBoer because clearly just sweet talking top recruits into joining his team isn't what he's best at, he's best at outsmarting the other team.

I think we need to see if it becomes an issue before we say it's an issue.

 

[Bamabuzzard]

If he doesn’t recruit, he will be replaced. Life continues either way

I think the transfer portal has become a safety net for sub par recruiting or recruiting misses. Granted, I'm not saying you can recruit like utter crap, but there's ALWAYS very good players at big programs unhappy and just looking for a chance.

 

[TiderJack]

Or maybe because the right opportunity came along. It's not like he's out there making lateral moves left and right. Every move he's made has been a promotion. Besides, he's only done it twice, not counting the jump from NAIA to FCS coordinator.That's kind of a bold assumption to make.

Agreed. Let's see, he left Fresno St after two years to take a Power 5 job in the Pac 12. Two years later he left Washington to go the the greatest football program of all time. Some will call it jumping place to place but I call it climbing the ladder to success which is what America is all about.

 

[sanjosecrimson]

We needed some good news. This definitely qualifies!