Poll: Does Tua Stay or Go?
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Imho Tua and Burrow are the only QB's in the SEC better than Mac right now. He's the Real Deal.
He has a really good arm and is super accurate and his Deep Ball is also really good.
The other Offensive players seem to really love him and love playing with him as well.
He's a TOUGH son-of-a-gun too. He's taken some BIG hits the few games and pops right up.... doesn't get rattled or anything.... next play he'll stand right in that pocket and rifle a pass at the last minute knowing he's about to get popped again.
To me he has the Passing ability of AJ if not maybe a tick better and the toughness of Coker which is a pretty good combo....Lol
He will definitely play in the NFL if his progress continues.
Those that think BY could just come in and unseat Mac are a bit 5-Star drunk imo.
I tend to agree with this. The only exception where you may get by without a superstar QB is if you have an elite defense. We had those defenses in the past and maybe that is why we won with game manager QB's. The Bama defense isn't what it used to be so we really need the NFL type QB now. Mac has played well in two games but teams haven't had much film on him. The better teams eventually figured out how to "bait" Tua into some bad throws so perhaps in time they will find a few flaws in Mac's game making him less effective.
On the play where we got the roughing the QB penalty, I thought they had broken his collar bone or worse. But he pops right up and continues the drive. I do think his passing ability today is just above AJ. AJ was a winner to the core though. I know he had a great surrounding cast, but so has every other Nick Saban QB outside of JP Wilson's 2007 season.
Unless you have 4 legit star WR's and a stable of good RB's.
I have no concerns about our regular schedule season next year if Mac ends up starting. My concern would be the playoffs where Mac would have to out-duel Trevor Lawrence and Justin Fields. We've gotten away with that once before when we beat Clemson with Jake Coker going up against Watson but that was one of the best Alabama defenses of the past decade paired with two of the most impactful special teams plays you'll ever see in a NC game..
Nowadays I'd prefer a QB with more mobility than Mac but he has been really impressive against some good teams.
I've been really impressed at his ability to throw accurately while under duress. I don't see why we can't win a title with him as long as we have the right players around him. Which we probably will on offense next season. As we've seen even Tua needs a defense. So our defense would have to get better.
That said, Mac isn't Tua and he is unlikely to make a play on his own that you would call special. At least right now. When Tua drops back to pass you almost hold your breath because you know something big could be coming. Mac just isn't that. He might not win you a game in the same way Tua might. He just lags behind Tua when it comes to his ability to navigate the pocket and throw the deep ball.
But again, I think we could win a title with Mac.
I've been really impressed at his ability to throw accurately while under duress. I don't see why we can't win a title with him as long as we have the right players around him. Which we probably will on offense next season. As we've seen even Tua needs a defense. So our defense would have to get better.
That said, Mac isn't Tua and he is unlikely to make a play on his own that you would call special. At least right now. When Tua drops back to pass you almost hold your breath because you know something big could be coming. Mac just isn't that. He might not win you a game in the same way Tua might. He just lags behind Tua when it comes to his ability to navigate the pocket and throw the deep ball.
But again, I think we could win a title with Mac.
It's a small sample size but Mac had a higher QBR this year than either Lawrence or Fields.
His stats this year if plotted out in a 13-14+ game season would actually surpass both.
Minus the running ability he is every bit a good as either of those two as a Passer.
The main unknown would be actual 'Championship Game' experience of course..... but I've seen nothing from Mac to make me think he'd be overwhelmed by the Moment.
In a championship settings, team have more time to scheme against a players strengths. We've seen this recently with Tua last year vs Clemson, Jalen vs UGA and Jalen vs Clemson in NC games. When a team schemes for Mac, they do not have to account for his mobility or play making ability outside the pocket. Whereas, a guy like Lawrence had over 100 yards rushing against OSU and his mobility was really the difference in the game. It can be done but requires a high level of execution by every player on offense for a QB like Mac to be successful..
Sorry, the officials were the difference in that game.
As for Mac - you cannot "scheme" a QB who plays well from the pocket if he is also coached well. You guys worry about defensive schemes because of what happened to Tua. Well, that happened because you were running a gimmick offense and you did not have a real QB coach. You are not running that kind of offense anymore.
One more point that needs to be brought up - Mac is smarter than Tua. Not disrespecting Tua's talent, but everyone in Alabama's program talks about how smart Mac is, and they always have. So, Mac does not have Tua's ability, but he is very well coached and he is very smart - and he also has above average arm talent.
You will take a step backward with Mac, but not as large a step as many of you fear, and certainly not the kind of step that should have you worrying about defensive "schemes" being his downfall.
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The ability to extend plays, make a first down or gain yards running is what makes TL and Burrow hard to defend. They are a threat to run..not sure Mac is so that would be my only concern with him. Saying that, Tua got hurt running so even if he comes back i dont see him scrambling like those QB's. It becomes a pocket passer comparison and thats a close call on what we have seen from Mac vs Tua.... small sampling from Mac, larger for Tua...but Tua seems just a bit better.
I finally got caught up on this thread after reading some last night and then again this morning. First, some great discussion here about Tua, Mac and Bama football!
Now some thoughts:
1. Tua: love the guy and seeing him in Crimson. Man, I'm torn about what he "should" do. I think "going" and "staying" both have huge upsides and risks. I'd selfishly like to see him play another year and, yes, I believe our potential for a NC next year is MUCH higher with Tua than MJ (see below). The point that offenses have changed in college football is a legit point and saying we'd be better with a game manager and strong defense is not supported by the facts of the last 3 years (including 2nd and 26). For those who think we'll be "better" with MJ, do you really think opposing SEC coaches would rather face MJ or Tua next year??? There's your answer. As for the team tanking around Tua's talent? I think that would be taken into consideration with a bunch of those guys returning to redeem this past year. It would be a TEAM effort not a TUA effort!
2. Mac Jones: I think there is some over-exaggeration of his skills and under-appreciation of his potential demonstrated here. I'm a little more "Missouri" on QBs and tend to believe you gotta "show me." Someone made the great point earlier that while MJ has shown great potential, he's done so in limited play. I'd almost guarantee you that most teams he's played against weren't game-planning against him as much as other "star" players. If he becomes the starter next year, you can bet teams will game-plan against him and figure out his weaknesses. I'd imagine he'd have some "soph. slump" games like most QBs do in the second year of starting. Also to say he's better than AJ McCarron and has NFL potential is quite the predication after Mac has only played in 4 games. AJM had 3 full time years of starting and couldn't but MJ can after 4 games??? Can he be a very good QB? He already is, but there are times when we just fall flat on offense (like in first half against UM) and it's like nobody remembers the two pic 6s against Auburn which cost us that game. MJ has great potential, but to act like we'd just not skip a beat on offense with him is a little bit too eager to me, especially considering if Tua goes our start receivers go too, most likely.
3. Bama Program: I think something even bigger than Tua's decision to possibly return might be the potential for him and other players to decide to return is the potential to "reset" the roster with more upperclassmen playing and allowing the younger guys to grow into those roles gradually (as opposed to getter thrown in there to learn on the job - which was what was wrong with our defense this year). Kudos to whoever mentioned this earlier, but if Tua and other offensive players return with Dylan Moses on defense we are suddenly set up the next few years of the dynasty with some great potential. Case in point, if Bryce Young plays under Tua next year, I think he steps into the starting role in 2021 and we hardly miss a beat in offensive production.
Now some thoughts:
1. Tua: love the guy and seeing him in Crimson. Man, I'm torn about what he "should" do. I think "going" and "staying" both have huge upsides and risks. I'd selfishly like to see him play another year and, yes, I believe our potential for a NC next year is MUCH higher with Tua than MJ (see below). The point that offenses have changed in college football is a legit point and saying we'd be better with a game manager and strong defense is not supported by the facts of the last 3 years (including 2nd and 26). For those who think we'll be "better" with MJ, do you really think opposing SEC coaches would rather face MJ or Tua next year??? There's your answer. As for the team tanking around Tua's talent? I think that would be taken into consideration with a bunch of those guys returning to redeem this past year. It would be a TEAM effort not a TUA effort!
2. Mac Jones: I think there is some over-exaggeration of his skills and under-appreciation of his potential demonstrated here. I'm a little more "Missouri" on QBs and tend to believe you gotta "show me." Someone made the great point earlier that while MJ has shown great potential, he's done so in limited play. I'd almost guarantee you that most teams he's played against weren't game-planning against him as much as other "star" players. If he becomes the starter next year, you can bet teams will game-plan against him and figure out his weaknesses. I'd imagine he'd have some "soph. slump" games like most QBs do in the second year of starting. Also to say he's better than AJ McCarron and has NFL potential is quite the predication after Mac has only played in 4 games. AJM had 3 full time years of starting and couldn't but MJ can after 4 games??? Can he be a very good QB? He already is, but there are times when we just fall flat on offense (like in first half against UM) and it's like nobody remembers the two pic 6s against Auburn which cost us that game. MJ has great potential, but to act like we'd just not skip a beat on offense with him is a little bit too eager to me, especially considering if Tua goes our start receivers go too, most likely.
3. Bama Program: I think something even bigger than Tua's decision to possibly return might be the potential for him and other players to decide to return is the potential to "reset" the roster with more upperclassmen playing and allowing the younger guys to grow into those roles gradually (as opposed to getter thrown in there to learn on the job - which was what was wrong with our defense this year). Kudos to whoever mentioned this earlier, but if Tua and other offensive players return with Dylan Moses on defense we are suddenly set up the next few years of the dynasty with some great potential. Case in point, if Bryce Young plays under Tua next year, I think he steps into the starting role in 2021 and we hardly miss a beat in offensive production.
The discarding of what Mac has done is more unfair than any over hype, IMO.
I'm not sure what you mean by "legit superstar QB". Mac Jones in his limited playing time this season has looked better than Joe Burrow did at any point in the 2018 season. I think you're looking at Mac Jones now as a finished product and not factoring in his growth in development that he will certainly have this off season. He's only going to get better. I think you're limiting "superstar qb" to a specific "type" rather than the results. Jones isn't going to bust an 87 yard RPO down the sidelines like Lawrence. But he doesn't have to in order to be an elite quarterback. Burrow isn't that great of a runner either. He runs just enough to hurt you. His poison arrows is his accuracy and mobility within the pocket. Which Jones has displayed he can do as well. He's already shown he can make subtle shifts and step ups in the pocket to keep a play alive. He has shown the skills to be an elite quarterback. Definitely has the tools to lead us to a title.
I think Jones ceiling is AJ, and I don’t AJ is a QB that can win you a title in 2020. I will be happy to be wrong. You will have to be able to match Lawrence and fields types of QB’s and beating a mediocre Michigan team and throwing two pick sixes agains the Barn hasn’t won me over. If he’s the guy next year I’ll be pulling for him and I will be hoping my thoughts on this are wrong.
Without someone to get them ball and make the big throw those WR’s are paper weights. Jones may be the guy, but I’m not convinced.
Agree on MJ's footwork and moxie in the pocket.
If MJ is the QB next year (and let's just assume we lose Juedy, Ruggs and Smith, which is entirely possible if Tua goes), I think the biggest "loss" other than Tua's obvious talent and playmaking and accuracy is we'll be less mature on offense around Jones.
Also, as we saw against UM, we'll also probably be less dynamic with our scoring offense so I think that means we'll have to depend more on defensive stops.
Could having a less dynamic and more "prodding" offense be helpful to our defense? Maybe, but, as others have pointed out, I'd be most concerned about the "big" games when we play the best defenses and the offense struggling to get output.
Don't know about ya'll, but the first half of the UM game was tough to watch. Outside of the first play of the game, I kept telling my dad, this is what an "average" offense looks like. And that was with our 4 horsemen at receivers. It all starts with the guy that touches the ball every play and I'm not talking about the center.
If MJ is the QB next year (and let's just assume we lose Juedy, Ruggs and Smith, which is entirely possible if Tua goes), I think the biggest "loss" other than Tua's obvious talent and playmaking and accuracy is we'll be less mature on offense around Jones.
Also, as we saw against UM, we'll also probably be less dynamic with our scoring offense so I think that means we'll have to depend more on defensive stops.
Could having a less dynamic and more "prodding" offense be helpful to our defense? Maybe, but, as others have pointed out, I'd be most concerned about the "big" games when we play the best defenses and the offense struggling to get output.
Don't know about ya'll, but the first half of the UM game was tough to watch. Outside of the first play of the game, I kept telling my dad, this is what an "average" offense looks like. And that was with our 4 horsemen at receivers. It all starts with the guy that touches the ball every play and I'm not talking about the center.
I think Tua goes. For most players it would be a no brainer, but with his injury history and family situation I understand why he'd want to come back.
I'm not sure it is realistic that all 3 of the super junior WRs go pro in any event though.
I watched UM all season - they would have the best defense in the SEC in 2019. Their defense is better than GA's. Sometimes you have to understand that the other team has something to do with your failures, just as they do your successes.Don't know about ya'll, but the first half of the UM game was tough to watch. Outside of the first play of the game, I kept telling my dad, this is what an "average" offense looks like. And that was with our 4 horsemen at receivers. It all starts with the guy that touches the ball every play and I'm not talking about the center.
Add the fact that you had very few possessions because your defense could not get UM off the field and you were not going to score many points.
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