QB Competition 2018

[gman4tide]

Help me for my memory is terrible. Did we have the "guns in the holster after a touchdown" gimmick in 2016? If we did, I missed it but I sure don't like it in 2017.

No, in 2016 it was the "dusting" motion on his chest.

 

[BamaMoon]

It's taken me a LONG time to 'see the light' with regards to last year's Clemson game. I wrongly put most of the blame on the defense.

I think because the mantra was 'It's the GOAT defense....period....no question.' That was a damn bold statement. It was really hard seeing them give up 35 or more points two straight years to the same team after hearing that line over and over.

But I have finally come around to the fact they were put in an impossible situation to suceed by the Offense's lack of efficiency. I was cutting them slack because they did score enough points to win no matter how they scored them. I was also cutting #2 a lot of slack since he made an almost game winning run despite having a pretty bad passing game AND was a TF with a new OC.

I know all of this has been obvious to the majority of you for a while. But it's just really hit me hard the last month of this season. I've defended the starting QB a ton because he HAS made some improvements....but that's been offset by new problems popping up or rather bubbling to the surface.

The overall decision making has been increasingly poor with each team with play with a pulse. The not giving it off the RB, the lack of pocket awareness, not pulling the trigger on passing plays, freelancing plays and taking bad sacks, not throwing the ball away, and the most egregious error being completely unaware of the chains and LOS and stepping OOB and taking a LOSS of yardage. It just been inexplicably bad decisions.

I really got soured from that Miss St game....post game. The whole 'Hero Complex' of a halftime speech and 'driving the bus' and 'you can come or get left behind'. Yeah I'm sure that went over well with the 5 OL blocking, the WR's getting open all game basically just doing cardio, and the RB's getting carries taken away from them.

Then it got worse from there with the whole 'I was born for moments like these' comments......and especially when you see the skill players being visibly frustrated.

This isn't the Jalen Hurts show starring Jalen Hurts, Co-Starring Jalen Hurts, Produced and Directed by Jalen Hurts.

It's a TEAM game and everyone has to pull their weight and everyone has an important role. The QB's job is to DISTRIBUTE the ball to the skill players, be AWARE of the situation, and not put the team in precarious spots.

I still love our current starting QB. I do not think he's a lost cause as a QB. I think he can improve with better coaching. I also think he still has limitations right now that we don't have time to fix. I think he has an attitude issue that needs checking as well.

Sometimes it's not the worst thing to sit a guy on the bench to gain some perspective. I also think the guy who's been patiently waiting on the bench is already more polished and capable of beating a D1 defense like Clemson through the Air. If QB1 keeps playing how he's been playing then QB2 deserves a SHOT....a CHANCE to help the TEAM.

They can battle the whole thing out in the off-season no matter what but the time for winning or losing a NC is RIGHT NOW......not next year....NOW.

It would be a major disservice to the rest of the team to keep struggling doing the same things and lose because we are playing the 'let's not bruise someone's ego' game.

Wow, extremely well done!

It's also refreshing to hear how you went the process of "changing your mind" about something. All of us can be guilty of the flaw of not considering we could be wrong more often, but some people aren't humble enough to ever admit they were wrong about anything and then, they double down on their position to the point they start looking silly.

 

[Maxbama]

^^THIS!^^ One consistent trait we've witnessed with Hurts is that he tends to be late on throws, even when the receiver is open. Being late on a slant or crossing route can be disastrous. Normally, Hurts seems to struggle with anticipation on throws. He either doesn't trust what he sees, or he has trouble quickly reading the defense pre and post snap.

The other consistent thing Hurts does is he bails out of the pocket too soon. B1G pointed that out a couple of days ago.
We have the talent to be who we are - a pro style offense with talent to make it work. Yes, that is a weakness for JH but we need to sustain drives and wear down our opponents defense. That is our style. In the game last year - Clemson did that to us and we had an excellent Defense. We just couldn't sustain anything and give our Defense time to rest. I feel like we abandon our run too soon in a game (play calling). If we can hitch up our Big Boy socks and make the defense adjust to stop our great running backs, than JH can play action pass (which he appears to be more comfortable doing) and take shots with the pass that are better for us.
After the first drive in the second half of the IB, I thought to myself - yes, run it on the perimeter with our great backs. But we did not sustain that with our play calling (or Auburn suddenly adjusted to it). The key is going to be 3rd downs to keep our offense on the field. Feed our playmakers and take opportune shots when we dictate with the pass.

 

[Maxbama]

Did Hurts go 25-2 over the last two years, or did the team go 25-2? I keep seeing Hurts' starting record brought up like it is some hugely relevant point, but I just don't think it is. We have amazing players at every position on the field, and I'm willing to bet that the other 21 starters on the team had more to do with getting us to the Championship game last year than a true freshman QB did. If you could demonstrate where our record and play has greatly improved or regressed with Hurts in or out of the game, you might have a point. But Alabama has been going 12-0 or 11-1 in the regular season every single year since 2007 with the exception of 2010. Tua is also not a completely unknown quality. He has substantial playing time this season, more than any other backup QB Saban has had at Bama. Sure it was usually after we were 2-3 scores ahead, but he still played very well and has played with the starters. In fact, besides the pick 6 I think Tua outplayed Hurts in the Tennessee game. Notice no one is introducing the unkown quality of Mac Jones into this discussion. The question is who on our roster can get the most out of this offense. It could be Hurts, it could be Tua. But what we have seen is Hurts superman our offense into a one-dimensional trick.

This is a key point. What we should be discussing is can JH improve in some of the things we see TUA has a strength in. Quick reads and a lightening release. The play calling has been trying to protect against JH's weaknesses. Our coaches need to take a chance and call the game to win it. If JH can't make those plays we may not be able to win. Right now, our opponents watch film and they see JH weaknesses. They know we are not going to try to run those plays. They can use defensive schemes to keep JH contained and we are not doing anything to address that.

 

[PA Tide Fan]

What we should be discussing is can JH improve in some of the things we see TUA has a strength in.

Here's good example of what Tua can do and what Jalen needs to do. Notice this was a 3rd and 15 play. I'm almost certain Jalen would have taken off here and tried to run for the 1st down but Tua wanted more.

 

[JustNeedMe81]

Here's good example of what Tua can do and what Jalen needs to do. Notice this was a 3rd and 15 play. I'm almost certain Jalen would have taken off here and tried to run for the 1st down but Tua wanted more.

Jalen can do this.

 

[PA Tide Fan]

Jalen can do this.

Jalen can throw those types of passes if the primary receiver is open. There it looks like the play developed just as it was designed. Ridley was to get open and and he quickly did, so there was no hesitation by Jalen. I don't know what down that was but on 3rd down coverage is usually tight and 3rd down is where Jalen has problems. While Tua has no fear of firing a bullet pass between defenders it seems Jalen is too fearful of throwing a INT and tries to run.

 

[BamaMoon]

Jalen can do this.

Sorry, but if you see the play that Tua made and the one Jalen made as "equals" I think we'll just have to agree to disagree that their passing talent is in the same zip code.

 

[BamaInBham]

When did Alabama become scared or not man enough to push other teams around? This is supposed to be our calling card - MTAQ. Did you watch the AU game? Harris had 6 carries for 51 yard 8.5 YPC, Bo had 6 for 46 yards for 7.7 YPC and Jacobs had 6 carries for 25 yards 4.2 YPC. That's a total of 18 carries for 122 yards 6.7 YPC. We can run the ball on anyone if we commit to it. We were running the ball on Clemson just fine last year until Bo got hurt and the staff, for whatever reason, didn't have confidence in Harris and the other RBs. Clemson has a very good front 7 and it won't be easy but I like our chances if our RBs have more carries than we have pass attempts. We will have to complete some passes, no doubt about that, but the focus on this game should be getting the ball to the best position group on the team which is the RBs..

Not scared, just trying to face what IMO is reality, but hopefully you are right and I'm wrong - I'm certainly no expert. I just don't see Bama manhandling Clemson's DL. It is special. But the Bama OL is underrated, though IMO, not as good as Clemson's DL. AU's DL is good, but it is not Clemson's. But I believe that Saban and staff will be able to perceive the true nature of things, whatever it is, and develop an appropriate game plan. It may be limited by personnel, but will likely give Bama its best chance of winning.

 

[TiderJack]

Sorry, but if you see the play that Tua made and the one Jalen made as "equals" I think we'll just have to agree to disagree that their passing talent is in the same zip code.

I think we all need to pull back on the anti-Jalen talk. He is our QB that is leading us into the play-off to try to win a NC. You and the others need to get on board with it. Tua is not going to play unless Jalen gets hurt in the play-off. I am going to get behind Jalen and the "team" and hope we win it all which I feel like we can and will do (Vegas agrees). In the great words of Jalen "get on the bus folks".

 

[BamaInBham]

Then it got worse from there with the whole 'I was born for moments like these' comments......and especially when you see the skill players being visibly frustrated.

I agree with much of your overall post. I heard about these comments and listened to an interview with Jalen after the game, he said and I quote, "we were born for moments like these". I heard it with my own ears. Was there another statement made by him where he said "I..."? I'm just looking for clarification. Saying "I" would be "interesting".

 

[JTBama]

I think we all need to pull back on the anti-Jalen talk. He is our QB that is leading us into the play-off to try to win a NC. You and the others need to get on board with it. Tua is not going to play unless Jalen gets hurt in the play-off. I am going to get behind Jalen and the "team" and hope we win it all which I feel like we can and will do (Vegas agrees). In the great words of Jalen "get on the bus folks".

I don't think there is anyone here that is not on board and pulling for the team. This is just a discussion about offensive philosophy and the attributes each qb may or may not have. . There are people who see things from each side and even in the middle. I don't think for one second that there is anyone not pulling for this team regardless of who the qb is, at least that's not what I see here

 

[BamaInBham]

I think we all need to pull back on the anti-Jalen talk. He is our QB that is leading us into the play-off to try to win a NC. You and the others need to get on board with it. Tua is not going to play unless Jalen gets hurt in the play-off. I am going to get behind Jalen and the "team" and hope we win it all which I feel like we can and will do (Vegas agrees). In the great words of Jalen "get on the bus folks".

It certainly worked in the MSU game, but it did not in the AU game.

I agree that we have to be careful. It's like when you are enamored with someone but then something happens or time passes or you run into "someone better", etc. and you are not enamored anymore, the "magic" is gone. Then all the little things that were once so charming are not anymore, everything they do becomes irritating or at best empty. In your mind you begin to pick at everything, inexplicably you can begin to almost detest the person if you are not careful, though they haven't changed. It's unfair to them. He turned 19 ~3 months ago. He has the weight of the Bama world on his shoulders. He has done many good things and still can.

I don't think any, certainly not many, think Tua will start, but it's not out of the realm of possibility that he could play aside from injury. Hopefully, the offensive performance will not demand that.

 

[DzynKingRTR]

If I ever die and get reincarnated, I want to come back as Alabama's back-up QB. He is always awesome and can do no wrong.

 

[MobileBama84]

Jalen can throw those types of passes if the primary receiver is open. There it looks like the play developed just as it was designed. Ridley was to get open and and he quickly did, so there was no hesitation by Jalen. I don't know what down that was but on 3rd down coverage is usually tight and 3rd down is where Jalen has problems. While Tua has no fear of firing a bullet pass between defenders it seems Jalen is too fearful of throwing a INT and tries to run.

What you point out is truly obvious to all fans that have been watching Bama this year. Tua has the vision and quick decison making that Jalen does not posess. There is really no denying it......even I did and did not want to admit or believe it. I love Jalen and his team winning attitude, but we need a pure passer at QB and we can be almost unstoppable. Not to mention, Tua has some pretty good wheels on him as well I just hope we have a better offensive gameplan come Jan 1.

RTR!

 

[westide]

If I ever die and get reincarnated, I want to come back as Alabama's back-up QB. He is always awesome and can do no wrong.

If you ever die? I hope you are that optimistic about Bama beating Clemson!

 

[NationalTitles18]

If I ever die and get reincarnated, I want to come back as Alabama's back-up QB. He is always awesome and can do no wrong.

Full Banjeaux for you, sir.

 

[BAMARICH]

I think we all need to pull back on the anti-Jalen talk. He is our QB that is leading us into the play-off to try to win a NC. You and the others need to get on board with it. Tua is not going to play unless Jalen gets hurt in the play-off. I am going to get behind Jalen and the "team" and hope we win it all which I feel like we can and will do (Vegas agrees). In the great words of Jalen "get on the bus folks".

Similar to the words of Earle a few pages ago, stop telling folks what they should or should not do in this discussion. This discussion is alive because of Jalen’s performance and the apparent loss of confidence from his fellow players... not because we invented it. It’s up to JH to correct these things, and if he does I’ll be thrilled and we’ll have an improved team. If he doesn’t, however, then my hope is that we’ll either have Tua starting or JH will be relieved early enough in the game that we’ll have a fighting chance. It’s that simple.

 

[NationalTitles18]

Similar to the words of Earle a few pages ago, stop telling folks what they should or should not do in this discussion. This discussion is alive because of Jalen’s performance and the apparent loss of confidence from his fellow players... not because we invented it. It’s up to JH to correct these things, and if he does I’ll be thrilled and we’ll have an improved team. If he doesn’t, however, then my hope is that we’ll either have Tua starting or JH will be relieved early enough in the game that we’ll have a fighting chance. It’s that simple.

So I have to admit that I've thought the main problem has been the play calling. I still think that's a problem, but it seems the problems run deeper than that and JH has actually lost the confidence of his teammates. That changes the entire dynamic top to bottom.

TBH, the last few months have been daunting for me so I haven't been able to get as deep in the nuts and bolts as I usually can and I've probably missed posts describing this issue. Now that things have settled a bit I'm able to spend a little more time and pay a little closer attention to detail.

I certainly appreciate the information, but it's concerning to say the least.

That said, I'm still of the opinion that a few have been a little too ambitious regarding Tua. Then again, I may be basking in ignorance. I will say Tua has a much higher potential ceiling as a passer than JH, and could see that from the start.

I trust CNS to figure it out and hope he does in time.

 

[TIDE-HSV]

Similar to the words of Earle a few pages ago, stop telling folks what they should or should not do in this discussion. This discussion is alive because of Jalen’s performance and the apparent loss of confidence from his fellow players... not because we invented it. It’s up to JH to correct these things, and if he does I’ll be thrilled and we’ll have an improved team. If he doesn’t, however, then my hope is that we’ll either have Tua starting or JH will be relieved early enough in the game that we’ll have a fighting chance. It’s that simple.

Thanks, BR. I was about to post something similar. Also, I've had enough of people trying to equate loyalty to the team to Hurts or any one player. In fact, that's our problem as a team right now. No one player should put himself above the team. I'm also tired of posts to the effect that we shouldn't even have a discussion at all...