The Church Thread: Chapter I Verse I

[RollTide_HTTR]

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Asking a psycho about his mental state of being is probably a wasted question. Crazy never thinks they're crazy; everyone else is.

Don't want to derail the thread so I'll avoid specifics but my entire family is currently dealing with a situation that proves this point to a T.

 

[selmaborntidefan]

“Christian, Catholic, Mormon. Anyone preaching that Jesus is God, essentially, the Trinity, a concept created by man, by Paul. He’s not God. God, the father alone, is God,” he said.

Asked whether he was ever victimized by a Christian, he replied no, and said his family is Christian and that he had a good childhood.

“I don’t hate Christians. I’m after the pastors that are leading them astray,” he said.


I have acquaintances on Facebook who express similar beliefs (not the killing part, of course).

They will ban you from the synagogue, yet an hour is coming for everyone who kills you to think that he is offering a service to God.
John 16:2

 

[BamaInBham]

The flood I have always just seen as a complete reboot into creation 2.0. If someone had wanted to they could have gotten on the ark. It’s also a story I have heard as a child so I have never overthought it too much.

But right now I am in a period where Israel moves into the promised land and wipe out thousands of people. Many of them were probably just minding their own business and got killed. Was everyone worshipping Baal all the time and deserved death.

Just comes into conflict with what I have always thought of as a loving God. I hope He forgives me for that.

A couple of things to consider that might help some. One is that God had been dealing with these inhabitants of Canaan, who were vanquished by reluctant Israel for 700-800 years. But they refused to repent: Worshiping false gods, engaging in temple prostitution, offering their children as sacrifices, engaging in sodomy, even as part of their worship, violent and corrupt. He would give them a taste of what would come if they refused to repent, with fire from heaven on filthy Sodom and Gomorrah. He then told Abraham that He would give them 400 more years. A total of 700-800 years is a lot of time.

Another thing to consider is that probably over half of their population was under the admittedly vague “age of accountability”, therefore, because of His mercy, they are today with the Lord.

As the NT is arranged, the first letter, which is to the Romans begins thusly, “The wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, for that which is known about God is evident within them because has made it evident to them. For since the creation of the of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so they are without excuse.”

He continues in the same vein through the middle of chapter 3, having made it clear that all men are lost, and cannot save themselves. He then makes it clear that He has provided salvation through faith in His Son Jesus Christ and his death at Calvary. That’s why He said through Peter ~30 years earlier, “There is no other name under heaven whereby you must be saved.”

 

[Huckleberry]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1938416759763259711

“Pro-life” Christian nationalist pastor Andrew Isker - from Jackson County TN - outraged about taxpayer money being spent to “keep old people alive.”

 

[CrimsonJazz]

“Pro-life” Christian nationalist pastor Andrew Isker - from Jackson County TN - outraged about taxpayer money being spent to “keep old people alive.”

Sounds like he would fit right in up in Canada. I'll volunteer to help his dumb ass pack.

 

[CrimsonJazz]

 

[CrimsonJazz]

 

[Huckleberry]

NYT gift link


I.R.S. Says Churches Can Endorse Candidates From the Pulpit
In a court filing, the tax agency said a decades-old ban on campaigning by tax-exempt groups should not apply to houses of worship speaking to their own members.

Christian nationalism-embracing media figures declare victory after Trump IRS argues that churches can endorse political candidates

Christian nationalism-embracing media figures cheered the IRS’ statement that the Johnson Amendment — a decades-old ban on tax-exempt nonprofits engaging in politics — should not apply to churches, celebrating that “churches will now be unshackled.”In a July 7 court filing indicating...

www.mediamatters.org

Christian nationalism-embracing media figures declare victory after Trump IRS argues that churches can endorse political candidates
The nation’s largest network of nonprofit groups warned that the “decree could open the floodgates for political operatives to funnel money to their preferred candidates while receiving generous tax breaks”

 

[75thru79]

NYT gift link


I.R.S. Says Churches Can Endorse Candidates From the Pulpit
In a court filing, the tax agency said a decades-old ban on campaigning by tax-exempt groups should not apply to houses of worship speaking to their own members.

Christian nationalism-embracing media figures declare victory after Trump IRS argues that churches can endorse political candidates

Christian nationalism-embracing media figures cheered the IRS’ statement that the Johnson Amendment — a decades-old ban on tax-exempt nonprofits engaging in politics — should not apply to churches, celebrating that “churches will now be unshackled.”In a July 7 court filing indicating...

www.mediamatters.org

Christian nationalism-embracing media figures declare victory after Trump IRS argues that churches can endorse political candidates
The nation’s largest network of nonprofit groups warned that the “decree could open the floodgates for political operatives to funnel money to their preferred candidates while receiving generous tax breaks”

What's the big deal here? Have we forgotten about the "black church"? They've been in the business of politics for a hundred years or more. I don't quite see how this helps one party over the other.

 

[CrimsonJazz]

What's the big deal here? Have we forgotten about the "black church"? They've been in the business of politics for a hundred years or more. I don't quite see how this helps one party over the other.

It doesn't. Churches have been pulling this stunt for a long time now and this changes nothing. If the Johnson Amendment were to actually start being enforced, it would disproportionately effect black churches more so than white churches and everyone knows it.

 

[Huckleberry]

It doesn't. Churches have been pulling this stunt for a long time now and this changes nothing. If the Johnson Amendment were to actually start being enforced, it would disproportionately effect black churches more so than white churches and everyone knows it.

Enforcement of the Johnson Amendment would put an end to any church endorsing candidates from the pulpit. This is a move to strengthen the Christian Nationalism movement and involve the government in religious matters. This decision will allow big money donors to further influence the political landscape.

 

[AWRTR]

What's the big deal here? Have we forgotten about the "black church"? They've been in the business of politics for a hundred years or more. I don't quite see how this helps one party over the other.

You beat me to the comment.

 

[CrimsonJazz]

Enforcement of the Johnson Amendment would put an end to any church endorsing candidates from the pulpit.

Maybe. Which party is going to do that, though? One would think it should be a bipartisan effort, but bipartisanship rarely ends well for the people these days.

This is a move to strengthen the Christian Nationalism movement and involve the government in religious matters.

Heh, no. The so-called CN movement can be reduced to a handful of internet grifters who make enough noise to be noticed, but have nowhere near the support the media and left-wing influencers would have you believe. It's just another ridiculous scare-tactic. (Kinda like when right wingers start in on immigration with "They're gonna take er' jerbs." I love South Park.)

This decision will allow big money donors to further influence the political landscape.

I don't see how they can possibly have more influence than they already do. The donor class runs literally everything now. And don't get me wrong, I am STRONGLY in favor of separation of church and state. I am firmly behind the purpose of the Johnson Amendment.....at least it's official purpose. (The real purpose was to keep Texas churches from telling their flock what a piece of crap Johnson was.) I don't think the JA is wrong, I just don't see it ever working as intended. Enforcement of it will require guts and that is something that is very much in short supply in D.C. these days.

 

[AWRTR]

Enforcement of the Johnson Amendment would put an end to any church endorsing candidates from the pulpit. This is a move to strengthen the Christian Nationalism movement and involve the government in religious matters. This decision will allow big money donors to further influence the political landscape.

Since it hasn't been enforced on any level for years what it does is level the playing field for everyone. Now churches that were trying to follow the law will be able to do what others that ignored the law were already doing.

Just to be clear I'm not for churches endorsing candidates at all, but if some do and get away with it then all should be able to. The church I attend doesn't endorse anyone and won't start. The leadership is against it.

 

[CrimsonJazz]

Since it hasn't been enforced on any level for years what it does is level the playing field for everyone. Now churches that were trying to follow the law will be able to do what others that ignored the law were already doing.

Just to be clear I'm not for churches endorsing candidates at all, but if some do and get away with it then all should be able to. The church I attend doesn't endorse anyone and won't start. The leadership is against it.

Yep, church attendees are a more diverse demographic than they are given credit for. In an age where it's already hard enough to keep people coming (and tithing) it's practically suicidal to get political and drive away a significant portion of your base.

 

[AWRTR]

Yep, church attendees are a more diverse demographic than they are given credit for. In an age where it's already hard enough to keep people coming (and tithing) it's practically suicidal to get political and drive away a significant portion of your base.

The pastor at my church preached a sermon the Sunday before the election and his main point was stop looking to any of the these politicians to fix things. They are fallible men they aren't your savior. God is where hope is found. He pretty much bashed them all.

 

[Huckleberry]

Maybe. Which party is going to do that, though? One would think it should be a bipartisan effort, but bipartisanship rarely ends well for the people these days.

It should be the democrats, but there's not a chance of that happening until they return to power. And even then...

Heh, no. The so-called CN movement can be reduced to a handful of internet grifters who make enough noise to be noticed, but have nowhere near the support the media and left-wing influencers would have you believe. It's just another ridiculous scare-tactic. (Kinda like when right wingers start in on immigration with "They're gonna take er' jerbs." I love South Park.)

I wish I had your optimism, but the ongoing success of the Project 2025 agenda leads me to believe otherwise.

I don't see how they can possibly have more influence than they already do. The donor class runs literally everything now. And don't get me wrong, I am STRONGLY in favor of separation of church and state. I am firmly behind the purpose of the Johnson Amendment.....at least it's official purpose. (The real purpose was to keep Texas churches from telling their flock what a piece of crap Johnson was.) I don't think the JA is wrong, I just don't see it ever working as intended. Enforcement of it will require guts and that is something that is very much in short supply in D.C. these days.

Agreed. It will take political will and courage to do the right thing.

 

[crimsonaudio]

What's the big deal here? Have we forgotten about the "black church"? They've been in the business of politics for a hundred years or more. I don't quite see how this helps one party over the other.

What should be happening is the enforcement of the IRS rule banning it in the first place, not throwing up our hands and saying 'we can't stop it'...

 

[CrimsonJazz]

What should be happening is the enforcement of the IRS rule banning it in the first place, not throwing up our hands and saying 'we can't stop it'...

Agreed, but both parties stand to lose support from such an act. I'm all about doing it, but it takes more cojones than D.C. actually has.

 

[CrimsonJazz]